Rush Limbaugh: Attacked by the Party?
By absentee Posted in Archived — Comments (220) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
The Republican Party, for good or bad, happens to be the home of conservatism right now, and the Republican Party is doing its best to marginalize conservatives and their influence, hence all these attacks on talk radio and talk radio hosts and so forth.
That's from Rush Limbaugh's show yesterday. I think that this is a fascinating statement, and a revealing one at that.
The Republican Party is doing its best to marginalize conservatives? That is a view I see repeated quite a lot. My excellent friend and Redstate superstar
E Pluribus Unum has hinted at this. Rush thinks it is so. Ann thinks it is so. It is fast becoming prevailing wisdom that this is so.
What does it mean, I wonder, to suggest the party wants to marginalize conservatives? It this a logical interpretation of events?
This is what I see. The MSM, the blogs, the columnists, TownHall, National Review, and the candidates themselves are focused on the rift between John McCain and the party's conservative base. Everywhere I turn, someone is talking about the party marginalizing conservatives, or John McCain courting conservatives, or how the party needs conservatives to win. It is almost the sum total of political conversation on the right for weeks now. John McCain and staff are trying their very hardest to point out that he is conservative by nature, if not a conservative. It's their campaign focus right now, as being the conservative candidate was Romney's focus before.
Marginalize: to place in a position of marginal importance, influence, or power
Maybe you see what I am getting at here.
What about attacks on Talk Radio?
I do hope that at some point we would just calm down a little bit and see if there's areas that we can agree on for the good of the party and for the good of the country. I haven't responded to any of it, as you know, and won't, but I think it might be a good idea if we -- I think they've made their case against me pretty eloquently, if that's the right word, I think they've made their case against me, and I think the majority of Republicans across the board have stated their view, and so I hope that maybe we can now join together for the good of the party and the good of the conservative cause.
That was Senator McCain's statement. If that is an attack then I'm an envelope.
When did victim culture become part of the conservative identity? If you disagree with Rush Limbaugh, then you are attacking talk radio? If you don't have a conservative candidate as the nominee, then you are marginalizing conservatives?
These do not stand up to reasoned examination. Besides, we are wrapping ourselves up in a losing proposition. We are saying that not having the nominee marginalizes us. They aren't saying that, we are. We are creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. I can already hear Huffington and Kos, "Limbaugh says age of conservatives finally over!"
If we try hard enough to convince people we're marginalized, then it will be so. The worst is that it is just not true.
Rush and the chorus of conservative voices are far from being marginalized; they are being courted. They are being given platforms, their input is being sought. Rush and Hannity, they have real impact on elections, as do their vast listener base. From Karl Rove talking about them to Brit Hume, to the girls on the View gossiping about them, the conservative media figures are anything but marginalized.
Vilified by the press, sure; But vilified by the Republican party? Absurd.
When Al Gore was not elected President, the wailing masses suggesting their voice didn't matter anymore in America were a spectacle of angst. I mocked them for sore losers and, when given the opportunity, lectured them about democracy. I am wondering who needs a lecture at this moment.
Rush, the people are the party. That we haven't established one of our own in the leadership is our own fault. I suspect we the people have lazily grown accustomed to you speaking for us, and so have failed to speak for ourselves. That is not a betrayal by the party, that is a betrayal of the party.
The Republican Party wouldn't try to marginalize conservatives any more than they would try to marginalize Floridians. The party produces candidates for office from among available candidates, and when the time comes to stop Hillary, they grow up and do so.
No power is lost by conservatives if John McCain is elected, regardless of the level of support. In four years, the same power will exist. There will be candidates to choose from, and votes with which to choose them. Conservatives, unlike many groups, will have the added power of talk radio and the internet reinforcing our voices and spreading our influence.
Marginalized? Our muscles are stronger than ever. I know of no other group so thoroughly addressed and so vigorously sought this election.
There is a proper course of action for conservatives. David Limbaugh knows what it is. Work on John McCain. "Hold his feet to the fire" for the ways in which he is not conservative. Take him to task for his major failings. Conservatives have this power ... exercise it!
Withdrawing from the arena isn't how to win the game, and neither is fussing that nobody listens to you. Get in the game and play ball, that's how you win.
John McCain's election won't marginalize conservatives, but conservatives telling the world that we are on the margin will.
absentee
Gideon I should hire you. You got me on NRO and are pimping me for editorial status at Redstate?
What is your fee structure?
absentee
Under what moniker, if I may ask?
"All that need be done for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
always see things exactly through the same prism as he, but a McCainiac? Far from it. He has articulated some of the most persuasive arguments as to why we should hold our collective noses and vote for McCain.
We're probably going to need to have some more of those, but he is reasoned and articulate at a level far beyond many on here.
"All that need be done for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
"All that need be done for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
I think what is most needed now is a timeout - like a GOP-group vacation in the Caribbean. Some time to relax and decompress would really help.
"Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and blood-thirsty, in their own regions the Wahhabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account" - Winston Churchill, 1921
========
Considering where the good doctor's head was, when practicing medicine, is it any wonder that the man has issues?
I can see it too.
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
that Matt Blunt could have been too. His future now seems highly uncertain after dropping out of the race. Hopefully there is an announcement coming that will put him more in the national spotlight.
Fighting for conservatism one day at a time.
Blunt was very good on fiscal issues, tort reform, and voter IDs, but he pissed off the socons by his support of stem cell research. Plus, he doesn't really have a compelling personality - the kind of charismatic personality you would need to be a successful national politician.
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
Do you think that he is done in office? Or, is he stepping aside to run for his dad's seat next time around?
Fighting for conservatism one day at a time.
I suppose he could run for his dad's seat, but Roy probably isn't going to retire anytime soon.
Although going from governor to the U.S. House would be an odd transition.
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
Just asking for your thoughts. I could see him running in 2010 if Bond does not seek re-election. I don't think Bond is ready to retire yet, but it is 2 years away.
Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn't mean politics won't take an interest in you.
-- Pericles (430 B.C.)
"Free Government Requires Active Citizens"
www.missouriyr.com - Missouri Federation of Young Republicans
If I were to pick the next candidate for senate it would be Todd Akin, or perhaps Sam Graves. Rod Jetton has indicated a desire to move up and out of the statehouse as well.
Depending on what happens with the governor's race this year, Kenny Hulshof would also be on the short list.
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
He's my favorite politician, period (and my rep). He's up there with Talent. I would LOVE to see Akin run for Senate.
The Unofficial RedState FAQ
“You are not only responsible for what you say, but also for what you do not say. ” - Martin Luther
I can't tell you how I know, but let's just say there are certain elements within MO politics that would ensure Graves wouldn't make it.
And, personally, after all the different scandals involving him, and the fact he's having troubles against Kay Barnes...I don't think he's our pathway. I can see Kinder, Jetton, possibly Emerson or Steelman.
Vote for the ulti-Mitt conservative. Romney '08!
DISCLAIMER: I am loosly affiliated as a volunteer for the Mitt Romney campaign. All viewpoints expressed are my own, not the campaign's.
She's amongst the liberal wing of the GOP. Her district is very conservative, and the only reason she even has her seat now is because she inherited it from her late husband. Her current husband is a big time Democrat fundraiser.
Emerson voted in favor of expanding SCHIP, and she consistently votes for the Democrat Iraq withdrawl bills.
“.....women and minorities hardest hit”
Good to see the entire "calm down" McCain quote. Usually all we get is a paraphrase of the first line. (Usually, editing out the "we" part and making is seem like he was just calling on the other side to calm dowm.) In the full context it reads very differently.
There has always been a significant chunk of the party that has tried to marginalize conservatives. The party leadership has always been significantly less conservative than the base.
You can really see this dichotomy in some state Republican parties where there is a huge disconnect between the base and the party leadership and they have been completely successful in marginalizing conservatives. They haven't had that kind of success at the national level, but it hasn't been for lack of trying.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman
I'm open to this explanation of state Republican parties, but I do not understand it. Can you elaborate on what measures are being used in the effort to marginalize?
absentee
The way I've seen it done is when the party apparatus comes in and supports candidates who they know the base are strongly opposed to. We had a Ahhnold-type Republican governor in my state that was denied endorsement by the 2000+ elected delegates at the state convention every time, but he was fully supported by the party big wigs... which is what really matters in the end. They can step in and ask people to not challenge the guy in the primary, or if they do, they can attack him relentlessly and destroy his career, denying him the support of the party and actively working against the guy should he try to even run for dog catcher in the future. They have the ability to keep people in line.
It doesn't really apply in this case since there was no consensus establishment candidate but these people are certainly out there and they do want to marginalize conservatives, who they see as a necessary evil. They need our votes to get elected but the sure wish we'd shut up.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman
All the more reason that Rush is incorrect. He is asserting a national party policy, an active conspiring against conservatives. That's why I elaborated on the national voice.
Would you agree, then, that the Part at large is not trying to marginalize conservatives?
Also, all the more reason not for us to go around saying how marginalized we are. When you keep telling people you aren't important, they will unfortunately believe you.
absentee
They very much want to see conservatives marginalized, since by and large those who run the party are not really conservative, and they don't believe conservative ideas are all that politically feasible anyway. That's why we have got exactly one complete conservative as a Presidential nominee the past 30+ years... and we got him over the objections of most of the party establishment.
So while I think he is generally right about the sentiments of the party, I just don't think it applies in the case of McCain, who won by beating a weak field where nobody was able to catch fire and the votes were spread out. It was the perfect storm for McCain this time around. That's not the party's doing... it just happened.
So, anyway, I'd say he's right in part and wrong in part.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman
The party is a structure, one we are part of. That the candidates are forced to publicly genuflect to conservative groups is an accomplishment.
That they know they need conservatives to win is a victory.
That the main stream media knows and reports this is a miracle.
That we fail to capitalize on our power? That's a tragedy.
I don't have the same estimate of bad faith about the party leadership. However, suffice it to say that if we start declaring ourselves the losers, then so we are.
absentee
We can't give up. We have made some significant gains since the 1970s. We need to continue to work from inside the party to try to change it so it better represents our ideals. That includes supporting a guy we might not like all that much in the hopes we can do better next time, instead of taking our ball and heading home. I think we agree on that much.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman
I know we agree on that much for sure. I was more on about the declarations of impotence and the ugly defections by our media voices. Unlike Rush I don't the Republican party is trying to marginalize conservatives. Like I say, if anything they court us like the only single girl at the dance. I believe the lack of top tier candidates is largely our own failing.
Mostly, though, I just think giving the left-media the victory they have always wanted is a catastrophic strategic error, especially for the wise Rush.
Thanks for the discussion zuiko. You're one of the best commenters at Redstate.
absentee
I believe that many of the party leaders really don't like conservatives. I don't mean that they hate us, but that they disagree and feel somewhat uncomfortable with us. A strong conservative, constitutional worldview isn't popular because they lose power when it is in place.
Sure, they court us during elections because they know that they have to have our support and votes, but its more like the popular guy going after the ugly but smart girl so she will help him with his science project. Once the science project is done, so is she. Now, not all of our party leaders in the RNC, etc do this, but more often than not it surely feels this way.
However, as you, Zuiko, Neal, and others have said, this does not excuse us from working as hard as we can to elect solid conservatives from the bottom up and gain a position of control. We have to get the message out that government is never the solution to a problem, but that personal responsibility in combination with our freedoms and abilities as Americans is. It isn't an easy task, but we must, and can, do it.
In a scenario like zuiko outlined above I could see that. At the national level I have no reason to believe it. If the evidence that party leaders don't like conservatives is a paucity of conservative candidates, it's not very compelling evidence.
If the evidence is that conservative ideals by nature reduce the power of individual politicians, I suggest that concluding based on that is an ad hominem circumstantial fallacy.
But even granting that some in the party are not happy with conservatives, it is a pretty significant leap to suggest that "the Republican Party is doing its best to marginalize conservatives and their influence."
absentee
Lott out and out said he didn't like the power of talk radio.
Note all the left side of the Republican party that actively endorsed McCain. Crist, Ahhhnold, so on. The "insiders" rallied around the "insider".
One of the complaints about the last Repub. dominated Congress was they really weren't conservative. Some of their great accomplishments included; more earmarks, vastly increased spending, poor record on fair trade, failure to move away from oil dependency, and in John's case, assault on; free speech, lawful immigration, alito, and so on.
So, judge them by what they do, and not what they say.
If this isn't proof I don't know what is, other than the "insiders" smearing all of the conservatives. Oh wait, that actually happened. Remember John's wonderful foul mouth towards conservative Repubs. that dared to vote against his god inspired amnesty. His tirade against evangelicals. Oh, you forgot about that. Very convenient for the party apparatchics isn't it.
Yes, I am supporting John as much as I can, its just very obvious that actions speak louder than words.
In the end, one would hope that a few conservative principles might just sneak through. I also strongly support the rank and file, who have to have a place to go. The Repub. party is the place, but we have to keep working on it so that it doesn't become a "Democrat lite".
Personally, I believe that Pro-life, evangelicals, mormons, conservative talk radio, gun owners are just voting machines for the insiders who actually run the party. Just try to nominate a Huck or a Mitt or listen to Rush and all hell breaks loose.
Both Huck and Romney have much better conservative records than John, but they were played off against each other like
oil and water. Mean while the party "insiders" went with one of their own. Tell me I'm wrong here.
Just my opinion.
I guess you could also say that the conservatives have tried to marginalize the moderates in the party as well. Or put differently - all people in the party are trying to make the party more like themselves. Our coalition works as long as we make it work. It isn't just a coalition of economic, defense and social conservatives, it's filled with people who are moderate and people who are conservative (on some or all of the issues).
We talk about a big tent and then we try and shove the more moderate out of the tent. There are exceptions - Chaffee for example should not have been a Republican, but Specter, Collins, Smith and Snowe should be welcome in our party instead of treated like lesser Republicans or RINOs because they aren't as conservative as others. I think the moderates need to accept the coalition a little more too. That doesn't mean we shouldn't fight for our ideas within the party, but accept that those who disagree with us hold their ideas with good faith.
As for the leadership, they have to be leaders of the entire spectrum of the party, which I have come to accept will almost always be more moderate than me. In order to make the leadership more conservative, you are going to have to move the center of the elected official to the right - and that starts at the bottom. That will take a lot of time too. If we start pushing for more conservative nominees for lower offices they need time and experience before moving up (which is why the Senate is filled with a lot of lesser conservative Republicans, turnover there takes a long time).
I hope that's somewhat coherent :)
___________________________________
Two thirds of the world is covered by water,
the other third is covered by Champ Bailey.
But when I'm talking about the base, I'm talking about the activist base who are actually committed and willing to work for the party. They are much more conservative, as a whole, than the people who end up running the machinery, for whatever reason. We need moderates too, but they mainly show up and vote for the Republican if their Magic 8 ball tells them that's the party they should vote for this time around. There are committed Republican moderates out there, but they are in the minority. Most committed Republicans are varying types of conservatives, at least from my experience. It would be nice if the leadership represented that better.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman
Just yesterday I heard Rush saying (these are not his exact words), that a "big tent" Republican Party should not tolerate moderate or liberal Republicans, but it should expand the conservative base.
"Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and blood-thirsty, in their own regions the Wahhabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account" - Winston Churchill, 1921
to some extent and agree to another. There's a little bit of both happening, I think. The Republican establishment has turned away from core Conservative values. Concurrently, it took Conservatives seven years before voicing their outright disgust with legislation and policy (harriet miers, immigration).
As important as we (political junkies) view this 2008 election, we ended up with sad slate of presidential candidates (for one reason or another). We simply have to deal.
It is up to all of us, Conservatives, Republicans, Right-leaning Independents, Libertarians, to engage and be active the next two years. And the two years after that. And so on. Not easy when most if not all of us have full-time jobs and families. But, those are exactly the reasons we need to do this.
R.J.
"It is up to all of us, Conservatives, Republicans, Right-leaning Independents, Libertarians, to engage and be active the next two years."
Exactly, exactly, exactly. We are not only not marginalized, we hold the cards. We just never play our hand. There are governor's races coming, there state elections to be considered and, most critically of all, there is a Republican party apparatus out there. It will reflect who powers it through money and effort.
absentee
The first time conservatives overwhelmingly stood up and roared at GWB was when he tried nominating Harriet Meiers to the SCOTUS followed by an even bigger roar about McCain-Kennedy.
The handwriting was already on the wall when he jettisoned school vouchers from the NCLB act because Kennedy refused to support it otherwise. Hopefully, having learned our lesson that conservative values can never be taken for granted, I would hope that we collectively won't wait 6 years to roar our disapproval if/when McCain wanders off the reservation. The question is, given his disdain for conservatives the past 7 years, will it do any good.
"All that need be done for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."
I am sure Rush and Hannity voted for Bush in 2000 and 2004. yet I find in interesting that they "draw and quarter" McCain on a daily basis. Wasn't it Mr. Bush who signed McCain-Feingold in spring 2001! Didn't Bush try to nominate Harriet Myers for supreme court! President Bush was waiting impatiently to sign McCain-Kennedy! Bush acknowledges and gives validity to "man made global warming" rhetoric. Pres. Bush also administered the largest growth in federal govt. spending since LBJ! So I propose that Rush and Hannity now apologize to all of us( and I will apologize as well) for voting for a Liberal Republican like G.W. Bush and thus compromising our principles!!!
"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical." Thomas Jefferson
Bush does not badmouth conservatives or claim those who disagree with him are racists. He doesn't side with democrats against a large majority of republicans on issues conservatives care about. Sometimes Bush actually hears conservatives and changes his mind. Bush is a moderate policy wise. It is not the fact that McCain is moderate that is killing him with the base. Thats only part of it. Thats why the McCain > Hillary > Obama arguments don't work. Its not just policies.
disagrees with the base. I doubt he can. And so, he is what he is. He's a jerk, but now he's my jerk.
McCain beat Dems!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
the dems
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
So long as he doesn't make fun of you before he does it?
I'd rather have the guy who holds me in contempt (and lets me know it) as he balances the budget, reduces the deficit, protects the borders, protects my right to free speech (and own guns), and vetoes bills from time to time.
Even if he called me a racist emunctory organ as he did it.
Man is free at the moment he wishes to be. --Voltaire
It was at the end of the summer, and the Immigration Bill had just gone down in flames. President Bush invited Rush and Sean to the Whitehouse, to stroke their egos and sooth their feathers. Afterwards, Rush had nothing but good to say about GWB. Now he says he has had to endure a steady diet of "excrement" sandwiches for eight years. And Sean! He went on an hour rant about how our president was the savior of the nation. This happened just weeks after President Bush tried to force the Immigration Bill through the Senate. McCain won't kiss the pinky ring, so he is not a conservative.
Oh, by the way, did you know that Sean Hannity has been standing for his principals for 20 years? Find another line, Sean.
It's time for them both to STFU or say something positive about McCain. Or just bypass McCain and hammer on Obama and Hillary!.
Enough already from the whole lot of them.
doesn't get written up in blogs.
Hey gal in Old Europe where their is no First Amenedment, maybe you need to come home and re-read it?
smile
the msm spin and even redstate is not reality
reality is reality
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Obama and Hillary! are getting free media out of all of our wailing.
All these McCain sucks! McCain isn't a real conservative... It is just killing us.
The dems are on the verge of a BLOODBATH. Let them have it and all the negative press that goes with it. Heck, Sean, Rush, all of them need to encourage the bloodbath and beat on the dems daily.
They don't have to say nice things about McCain for now. Just shut up and beat on the dems. Hard and relentlessly. And we should be doing the same.
That's all.
and podcasts at night, I already see subtle shifts in tone. Its early. No one needs to shout STFU now.
But I know how we all want to ahead of the game.
Well, I used to. I now am more contemplative.
And tell Doc, that the above self puff up was only the 11th of the day!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
in a corner. The beclowning:) was the choice to put oneself in a corner when reality has forecasted otherwise for a long time. GC, I remember when you were a Rudy guy, now you are social con all the way, it is hard for me to understand the McCain Derangement Syndrome other than the idea that Dittohead really does mean what the libs have always claimed.
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Molon Labe!
the only candidate I ever explicitely endorsed was Fred. I leaned to Mitt twice.
You see Doc, you just did to me what you do to Rush, you overstate the case. Rush intentionally equivocates. Words matter.
Let me get your Holliday butt on the witness stand and I'll show you how much.
If a clown can be sent whimpering into the corner in a fetal position, then we'll call you
Doc Holliday!
smile
its a joke
be cool
the straight jacket is on the way
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
your positive or at least "open minded" words on Rudy many times. One thing I have is a pretty good memory. I have noticed a shift in your positions over time, I am sure you are aware of it. You are more of a religious social con today than you were a year ago.
It is ok, when I first came here I was Mr. libertarian, now I am forced to defend McCain lol. I am not saying your transformation is unusual, I am just saying what I have read from you in the past does not exactly fit with the McCain Derangement Syndrome of today.
btw, you WILL call me Doc Holliday or I will be your Huckeberry!
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Molon Labe!
unless my embrace of Fred's federalism is a shift away from the orthodox position.
Doc, have you read my MOST recent blog? I declare McCain MY JERK that I am excited to defend starting NOW against the left.
I have written many critical blogs on McCain in the past.
Doc, on my issue shifts and McCain, you are 180 degrees out of phase.
You have it exactly wrong. Well done.
Yes, you may have a good memory. Its just that you havn't enough to memorize.
Why don't you write a bog describing your GCDS in toto?
And maybe a DeVine groupie will google it and defend me!
Rush is my brother.
Why don't you get SPECIFIC, ie with quotes, and come back here. I was honorable enough to shut up earlier when you demanded same.
we luv ya guy
you see Doc, me and you and McCain have something in common
we are ass holes
unity
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
well I know you are McCain are orifices, I am just a warm fuzz ball like Rush :) Hey, I have said myself that you and I have a stormy friendship, I like it that way. Most people here just have sunny friendships with me, hmm. Anyway, I do actually agree with you, but could not do so other than obliquely :)
You ask for quotes, you say I have it all wrong, but I can provide quotes I hope, the search function here is basically none existent. I still say you have gone progressively more socon over the last year or so.
You probably remember that I officially endorsed Fred even when I knew I would be on the losing team. I did not say it so blatantly, but it was pretty much understood. I supported the man, when he was doing poorly, because his views were the most classically conservative. I said from day ONE he was not the candidate people led themselves to believe, and I said McCain would win, oh well, and I never gloated, I wanted Fred to win.
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Molon Labe!
btw, in GC mode, I think I was the first to mention McCain Derangement Syndrome here, I should get a royalty lol.
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Molon Labe!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I hate you
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
him now GC, if he falls for this old lawyer trick!
A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have. Thomas Jefferson
I said skin that smokewagon! ok, seriously, lets simmer down before we do a dual beclowning.
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Molon Labe!
I have taken your wrong a time or two, and always apologized or backed off. I know i have given you plaudits more than I have received them. I think you can have an off day from time to time, and this is one. I do not criticize your or even reply to you as a goal, we chat in the normal course of blogging and today you have been out of line attacking Absentee when his blog is at the top.
you have JHHDS (figure it out), I am just fine :)
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Molon Labe!
he was at the top.
still thinking on what be JHH...
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
out of line attacking Absentee when his blog is at the top
When there were 15 Fred blogs "at the top" did ANYONE complain about critics who attacked them?
When (briefly) there were dozens of Romney posts at the top, did ANYONE criticize those posts? Did anyone NOT criticize them?
Seriously, stop taking yourself so seriously.
how you think I am "more" so-con now? I have been a 100% so-con since 2000-1. Fred convinced me to not demand the life and marriage amendments, so in one sense I am less so-con. The war has always been the #1 issue with me for president since if a president won't defend us, we won't be defended.
I was wrong on some predictions re SC, from 2006, but git them right the week before. Really Doc, you should do like I do and totally focus on what I do!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I am cautiously optimistic about McCain after his CPAC speech, but now is not the time to let up. We need to hold his feet to the fire in a respectful way to obtain pledged concessions on future policy. I pledge that I will never ever attack his character as I did in the past but will respectfully disagree with his policy where necessart. He is cognizant of the necessity of conservative support, so grow up and drop the nastiness towards the Senator. If Mitt can support him, I can too.
Tim Schieferecke
The MSM is reality for about 90% of the voting public.
Let's step back and let the "reality based community" revel in their blood awhile instead of contributing to it.
false histories of Rush should, as C17wife says, STFU?
No, let them speak and they will be judged.
I trust that Rush will be well judged by what he actually says now, just as he is lauded for what he has said for 20 years, because Rush is
Right.
Judge Rush by what he actually says, in context, and not what others say he says.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
When I see moderates claiming that talk radio is too extreme and "gins up the right", that's an attempt to marginalize.
When I see moderates telling McCain how to woo the "far right", that's because the "far right" has been marginalized, or at least the attempt has been made.
When I see those same moderates address people of conviction and conscience as "the right wing" as means to label them as a fringe element, that's an attempt to marginalize.
When I hear them invoke the name of McCain in saying, well, he's better than the opposition, and he's "electable" I know it's because the Republicans are viewing their conservative base as too unpopular to stand with, and thus are as a group must be marginalized.
When I see them write on their blogs, that there's a "reality" now that can't be done away with, that McCain is the guy, and we must all rally around him "for the good of the Party", then I now, THAT'S MARGINALIZATION.
If you need any more examples, then you don't get it, and you are stuck in MARGINALIZE mode.
This conservative is SICK to DEATH of taking 3rd rate nominees and having to support their excessive concessions to the liberal leftist ideologues in Congress.
There is to be no reconciliation. The McCain maneuvering shows us how things are, and how things are to be. This is "clean break" time. I sever my ties now, and you can march into political ignominy without me.
Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind. - Albert Einstein
I have always felt like (and considered myself) a conservative. I have a bit of a libertarian streak and am not totally on board with the SoCon part of it other than being pro-life. In recent years, I have felt like I was being pushed out of the party by some. Candidates I liked were called RINO's (by extention, this meant I was one too) and it did make me feel like others felt I wasn't a 'pure' Republican. It made me very angry and upset and in some ways caused me to lash out because it didn't seem fair. Reagan was my hero, too - I didn't think anyone else had a right to tell me I didn't measure up because I oppose the FMA and would prefer to see spending cuts with my tax cuts and think it's more appropriate to ask for sacrifice during a time of war than ask people to go shopping.
Now my guy has won and I'm happy, but there are still some who say his victory is tainted because he got a lot of votes from moderates. Who says that moderate voters count less conservative ones? While it's true that you can't win without convervative votes, it's equally true that you can't win without moderates. This is the same attitude that Tom Delay (a man I loathe) had when he wouldn't bring things to the floor unless they were supported by 'the majority of the majority'. This is in fact the first time that the guy I supported at the start of the primary season has won the nomination (as I was to young in 1980 to care about primaries) but the other times, I fell in line with the nominee. A party is, but nature, a number of groups. If your guy does not win, it just means that you try again next time. That is what I have done and that is what everyone should do.
John S. McCain III
Eric Cantor for VEEP
Maybe you missed the truth thinking up all those pretty words. What other way would you describe redefining conservatism right under our noses? Yes, thats called being marginalized. He wins, his claims of being a true conservative are realized, and then the true conservative movement is seen as an extreme fringe element. He's expressed disdain for So-cons before. And yes, I do think that most of what it means to be a conservative are found in the conservatives values of true social conservatives. Without that base the republican party loses its soul so to speak and becomes literally just the party of the rich and elite.
And no, Huckabee is not the answer. He is a charlatan populist and no real friend to conservatism.
Go ahead, make your jokes, Mr. Jokey... Joke-maker. But let me hit you with some knowledge. Quit now.
-White Goodman
I don't really see how true conservativism is being redefined, unless you mean by people like me and E Pluribus Unum and TheSophist who have tried to put it into words.
Voting for a Republican nominee who is not a true conservative certainly redefines nothing.
We still have the same voting power we always had. We still have the same talk radio dominance. We still have our limited television personalities. We as conservatives still have those things.
We have our think tanks, we have our columnists. We have a party that we are invited to be a part of and work with. A party that Rush concedes has been our home, a party that gave us Reagan.
We have the national spotlight right now. CPAC coverage has never seen such saturation.
How, then, are we being marginalized?
absentee
I meant McCain. If he wins it validates his pseudo-conservatism. That is a serious problem and I think it is what is moving the ABM movement and causing others to look twice.
Go ahead, make your jokes, Mr. Jokey... Joke-maker. But let me hit you with some knowledge. Quit now.
-White Goodman
Well, it may. It may validate pseudo-conservativism as a viable political position. That is possible.
I do not think it redefines conservativism though. The differences between McCain and the conservative base are a matter of extremely public record now. He'll always be the guy who wasn't the true conservative.
absentee
He is the Reagan foot soldier, he knows what it means to be a conservative. His style is elusive I think because it is so ephemeral, so maverick. This fluidity and plasticity is what puts him at odds with the base and makes him such a natural bedfellow for Democrats. He is so obviously not not a conservative to us that it is not an issue of losing sight, but can you say the same for others? Don't we value open minded and progressive viewpoints in today's society? Conservatives have a very real threat to their identity with McCain as president. If this threat is not met, than Rush and others will be proven correct.
Go ahead, make your jokes, Mr. Jokey... Joke-maker. But let me hit you with some knowledge. Quit now.
-White Goodman
You have it exactly right. The GOP is the conservative vehicle. Conservatives now realize that someone hostile to the conservative agenda is driving the vehicle. Yet we are being told, "You must continue to pay for the gasoline, brakes, oil changes and tires for your vehicle."
Many conservatives are saying, "No thanks. I'll work to boot that driver out of my vehicle and then I'll worry about the tires and brakes and insurance."
To the facts in evidence. Conservatives are more well-defined and more readily accepted now than they were before. This McCain thing is working to our advantage, if we take the advantage.
Look, the MSM wants to destroy Republicans not conservatives. Conservativism doesn't run for office. Their investment in the Obamanon and Hillarycare has them painting CPAC as a mainstream event. They're playing us conservatives as the Davids against McCain's goliath. That will happen more not less, after the primaries are over, because they will think sowing discontent is to their advantage.
But it is to our advantage. How many more people know about CPAC? How many ABC News watchers now know about McCain-Feingold? About McCain-Kennedy?
We've been gaining ground for decades because our ideas are natural to people, they are logical. They are correct. Now Conservatives aren't a bad word anymore. All of a sudden we're a mainstream political force.
Time of death? Redefining? I think so! Time of death on back alley conservativism, and redefining us a major force. Every Tom, Dick and Harry is watching the Republican candidates bow and scrape for approval.
Even better than that though, they are seeing us handle it like grownups. They saw McCain treated with RESPECT at CPAC! Let some Democrat go against liberal orthodoxy and see how he is treated!
Don't you see? We're making huge ground here! Publicly, loudly, proudly conservative people are being treated favorably in the mainstream media. Treated like Adults! Pro-life isn't a dirty word anymore, now it's principled!
This primary season has been a public relations triumph, and those who ought to be the biggest beneficiaries of our dissent dividend are throwing it away in fits of pique!
It's our time now. It's our chance to show we can govern, that we can clean house, that we can accept those with whom we disagree, and do it like grown-ups. The day of conservativism is at hand. Don't lets drop from the race just before rounding the last bend! Don't let's turn back just before land is spotted over the horizon.
It is time for strategy, and no strategy is less profitable than taking a new-found microphone and yelling through it that you've failed.
absentee
"The Republican Party, for good or bad, happens to be the home of conservatism right now, and the Republican Party is doing its best to marginalize conservatives and their influence, hence all these attacks on talk radio and talk radio hosts and so forth." - Rush
your quote, from which all manner of non sequiturs have proceeded...
Ever been to a Hamptons party as a known pro-lifer, Christian? Rush and Reagan have.
Reagan spent two decades leading a conservative movement, trying to marginalize the countryclubbers. He and Newt finally succeeded. Then we let ourselves be marginalized. That is a fact. We win with conservatives doing the marginalizing, and Rush was speaking of how much more difficult it will be with McCain and a gop minority in the congress. He was not defeatist.
There is a decade of history with McCain vs Bush and the right. A decade or words and facts.
It is much easier for you and I to make about faces during political rallies or after Mitt drops out.
It would not be so easy if all our anti McCain language, supportable by facts, had been uttered in public and covered by the msm and the blue bloods.
a large ship turns slowly
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I don't get all that from that quote, the stuff about good public relations. Is that what you mean?
absentee
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I've got Hinz thinking I'm McCain-botting, I've got your head spinning, and I've got this splinter that is driving me mad!
I need some hot tea. It's times like these, Mike, that make me want to be a drinking man. Curses!
absentee
fish camp!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I feel the need to keep moving McCain further and further to the left to validate my point, which I think would be unfair. So you win in that regard.
However, it should be noted that if McCain selects a moderate running mate and wins the presidency, than the MSM will win and to a lesser extent McCain will win, because we will be obvious losers. Especially given your correct demonstration of the unprecedented coverage being given to the base right now.
As it stands McCain has not sufficiently reached out, and we do not know that he will. It is therefore appropriate and accurate for talking heads to be raising the alarm.
Go ahead, make your jokes, Mr. Jokey... Joke-maker. But let me hit you with some knowledge. Quit now.
-White Goodman
He is not a charlatan, and he has an excellent conservative record.
I support Governor Mike Huckabee for President.
When Rush refers to "the party" he means the blue blood country clubbers (FKA Rockefeller Repubs) in the Hamptons that despised Reagan and despise the hillbilly southerners and pro-lifers mainly because their wives want the right to kill babies in the womb so they can more easily play tennis when they want.
Rush met them and felt their ire when he moved to NYC for his show in 1988 and went to the parties near east egg.
But they bit their lip as they saw they could only win with them.
And yes, they, ie repub party leaders have been part of the msm chorus claiming that Rush et al are irrelevant, (so irrelevant that they talk of them 24/7!).
Rush is saying that they are TRYING to marginalize the base, not that we are marginalized, although given that McCain is the nominee, we are to some extent, mainly because one of US didn't run.
But, as usual, Rush is Right.
Parsing his words is not productive. Rush speaks 3 hours a day. One has to look at what he says as one loos at a long book.
The Wonder of Rush, before McCain, and after McCain.
Let's defend McCain from the left instead of trying to win points against Rush, eh?
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I certainly have no wish to win points. I don't think, though, that I was parsing. I don't listen to the show, but this quote was the thrust of something he posted on his site.
It's part of a larger picture of angst, though. Rush is the convenient, public example.
absentee
attempted marginalization within the GOP since Buckley.
eyes wide open
Rush has a show to perform everyday. He hasn't the luxury that we have to pick and choose when we speak. I know Rush, 18 years of everyday. He will come thru this with the same class and excellence that he always does.
and is now
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I really don't think I impugned Rush's character here. But he's not infallible.
When our loudest voices can't stop eulogizing us, and our blog voices can't stop crying about what once was, then we are becoming the architects of our own demise.
absentee
Why would our "loudest voices" amke this stuff up?
The beginnings of our demise occurred long, long before this. Rush et al are simply reporting this news - not making it.
But why, all of a sudden, is everyone so wrong? Especially Rush, who has been spot on for so long? Why do so many party faithful agree with him? Why am I considering leaving the party after 36 years?
Why?
I suggest that part of the reason for the third and fourth questions are the first and second questions.
Nevertheless, I think when you keep telling everyone you're a loser, soon enough you are. I have a habit of looking for the profit in things. I don't see the profit in your position. What's to be gained?
absentee
Unless you think the Party can survive without guys like Jack here?
Go ahead, make your jokes, Mr. Jokey... Joke-maker. But let me hit you with some knowledge. Quit now.
-White Goodman
McCain is winning in a popular vote among Republicans and Rush does not like it. And don't tell me about "open primaries" and other almost tin foil loser stuff, this is the system we have had for ages.
The reality is many more "conservative leaders" are telling us to stand together, Rush and Sean are just sore losers throwing a tantrum. I admit many take it to heart, but if they knew the real reasons, they would not seem quite so noble.
no one has told anyone to shut up. It is laughable when Rush talks of being attacked, he has attacked and mocked McCain for close to a decade, he almost deserves this. But the point is, Rush and Sean are the boys who cried wolf today, they say conservatives are under attack, but a hundred top shelf conservatives have backed McCain, Rudy, and party unity.
I don't care if Rush bemoans McCain. I think if he wins we WILL need to hold his feet to the fire. But the idea that these two radio talkers are under attack by the party is a freaking joke. Rush and Sean have been given preferential access to the top of our party for years. If they now attack the party, and talk of leaving it, then they should not expect to have rose petals thrown at their feet.
___________________________________________________________
Molon Labe!
are often heeded. McCain has ears. As do all of us that stopped Mc-Kennedy.
Radio transcripts aren't like columns. Speaking or 3 hours. "The Party" refers to the establishment as I defined above, hence
Rush was right
You were wrong
luv ya guy
smile
moving on to defend McCain from leftist attacks
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Loan me your Rush 24.7 login and I'll hear it on the podcast. ;)
Actually, I think my brother has one ...
absentee
subscriptions instead of checks...
Rush is an optimist about America. He said this week he does not ascribe to the "win by losing strategy". He has not eulogized. He has read some by Noonan. He has observed all thru the Bush years and now projects to a McCain v Dem Congress, the difficulty of elected party members to stand against their own president.
But if you notice, Rush is reserved compared to hannity, Levin and Ingraham. People have to vent, but Rush is quite cognizant that his words carry great weight and has always had the left ready to pounce.
Heck, Hillary formed Media Matters to do that, see Harry Reid's letter for example.
Rush will defend McCain when he is attacked from the left, as McCain is now the vessel for conservative values.
Rush is the Bold Colors of Reagan.
This is February. We just got the nominee. Wounds are fresh. McCain is what he is, a jerk.
But all will be well with Rush, who, in the scheme of things has been invaluable to the movement and America. More so in political terms post-Vietnam than any Bush or McCain.
Let's let the left attack Rush and then let's defend him.
He deserves it.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I just don't know. I don't remotely think I'm attacking Rush, not even a little. But I think he's wrong, and I don't think he's infallible. Now, the fact that I don't listen to his show may compromise my loyalty, but I've never suggested he wasn't invaluable to the movement. In fact, that he is such a bastion of the movement is a foundation of my point.
I hear you saying he's not doing that thing I think he's doing. But the excerpts I see, the things on his website, the clips I hear ... they don't tell the story you are telling.
If he is not reacting with the same defeatism that Ann Coulter is reacting with, then I can't distinguish the difference. It must be, as you say, that radio shows don't translate to transcripts very well.
absentee
if McCain is prez and tries to enact lib legislation with a dem congress. No eulogy. Just reality and how we can still win.
Ann says she is voting for Hillary. Rush has said not who he will vote for.
hardly equivalent
You see 'tee, I read all of War and Peace and hear all of Rush.
I am the expert on Rush.
The public may choose to take advantage, or not, to their peril!
There is no more optimistic about America American than
Rush
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
if he will vote for the Republican against a socialist, he is beclowning himself. I agree conservatives will have a major impact in Congress if McCain wins. I do not agree with how Rush is demoralizing Republicans and considering his personal power and hatred of McCain above the good of the country, full stop.
___________________________________________________________
Molon Labe!
Rush is not demoralizing me. I am a republican. Many republicans are demoralized, incl me, with the inadequate choices we had.
we disagree with the ascription of hate and the devalueization of love for America
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
prove it. I do think I could use the term on more time and I know whom I would use it for.
___________________________________________________________
Molon Labe!
judgment.
and just in case, I prefer Homey to either Bozo or Crusty.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Barry Goldwater was not a "blue blood country clubber," he didn't despise Southerners and he didn't despise Reagan. In fact, both man succeeded in part because of the other, and each greatly admired the other. Even so, Goldwater supported Roe v. Wade. But to use your logic, anyone similar in ideology to Barry Goldwater is unfit for the Grand Ol' Party.
"Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and blood-thirsty, in their own regions the Wahhabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account" - Winston Churchill, 1921
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
When Rush refers to "the party" he means the blue blood country clubbers (FKA Rockefeller Repubs) in the Hamptons that despised Reagan and despise the hillbilly southerners and pro-lifers mainly because their wives want the right to kill babies in the womb so they can more easily play tennis when they want.
Sounds like a comment from pro-life Conservative who doesn't believe a pro-choice Republican can be honorable. And I've heard it more than once from Rush - you can't be a Conservative if you are pro-choice. Are you going to tell me I didn't hear him correctly?
"Austere, intolerant, well-armed, and blood-thirsty, in their own regions the Wahhabis are a distinct factor which must be taken into account" - Winston Churchill, 1921
Rush played a clip today of his prediction of the McCain nomination from Oct. 2006. He said if conservatives sit out the election and let the dems take control of congress that the fear of Hillary with a dem congress would bring us McCain.
He is often right about the future and today made some predictions to how McCain will govern if elected. Don't get excited he is advocating the defeat of Hillary but with all the resevations of McCain that I have.
I am on board with McCain because of the war. As regards to the rest I am afraid we will hear a lot of buyer remorse and "I told you so".
That said we cannot afford a Dem.
I'm not surprised. Instead of recognizing that McCain is unacceptable, they blame the physiciaon that points out the obvious.
Kevin Price is Host of the Houston Business Show (M-F at 11 AM on CNN 650), Publisher of the HoustonBusinessReview.com and writes frequently in his www.BizPlusBlog.com.
I agree with this post 100%. I'm a fundamental conservative (100% FiCon, 85% SoCon) and I have listened to Limbaugh for over 10 years as he is the great rational voice of reason for conservatives. But Rush is dead wrong. Everyone is blaming McCain for being, well, John McCain. Rush scolded conservatives and republicans alike for sitting out the '06 election on principled grounds, but now he is playing a big role in making sure that happens with the next president. McCain is not what we wanted, but he is what we now have. When I look at our current President, and compare him to McCain, John looks like a far-right paleocon. Why cant Rush, and the other talk radio people admit what really happened and that is our current President is the main one responsible for splitting the party? The right has hid behind the tax cuts and war in Iraq, and refused to stand up to our RINO President as he embraced a socialistic fiscal policy.
When I look at our current President, and compare him to McCain, John looks like a far-right paleocon. Why cant Rush, and the other talk radio people admit what really happened and that is our current President is the main one responsible for splitting the party? The right has hid behind the tax cuts and war in Iraq, and refused to stand up to our RINO President as he embraced a socialistic fiscal policy.
Quoted for truth!
When Reagan left office, he was not that popular. It's a shame you have to resort to bashing Bush. History will vindicate Bush. He did some great things and many conservative things. The types of things only cultural warriors notice - he would not compromise on Kyoto; he appointed men who would stand up to the internatinalist like John Bolton; he appointed conservative judges - not only the Supreme Court, but on the appelate level, who would not compromise on stem cell research even though it was popuoa because he knew the real catalyst behind the movement who rabid feminism and abortion rights. He fought a lot of these good fights. He also cut taxes and was terrific fighting terrorism. He had a Republican Congress to appease on spending issues, something Reagan never had to deal with.
Bush bashing is lame. Stand up for the man. He's been gentleman and a warrior in these times. Heads and heals above anybody in the public arena, plus he did win three straight elections for us.
People trash the guy for the slightest offenses while he's in office, while overlooking the good stuff. Once he has been out of office for a while, they'll forget most of the bad stuff, while remembering most of the good stuff. I think Bush will be remembered by Republicans pretty favorably after he is out of office. He is the 2nd best Republican President in the past 50 years or so, after all.
---
Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman
I don't despise Bush either, although he is no conservative by any means, but this new founded animosity towards McCain is really pent up frustartion at Bush. Bush said we need to fight manmade global warming. Bush orginally led the fight for amnesty. Bush, unlike McCain, had no problem with the largest discretionary spending increase in the history of the country. Bush thought his personal fried Harriet Miers would make a great SC choice.
My point is, that if you compare our current president to the conservate anti-christ that is mccain, you end up asking why conservatives hate mccain but love bush, they actually shouldn't like either one.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
The McCain-Feingold battles began in the mid-1990s. Bush decided to cave in to McCain's relentless attacks on the 1st Amendment and conservatives don't appreciate that cave in.
But while Bush reluctantly caved in and signed McCain-Feingold, McCain was a true believer in trashing the 1st Amendment and filed a friend of the court brief against Wisconsin Right to Life.
McCain filed that brief against a pro-life group. Bush did not.
I hold as much animosity towards Bush. I believe he has played a big part in the decline of conservative ideology in the Republican party.
"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical." Thomas Jefferson
I believe some of the party elites have been wanting to marginalize conservatism as an ideology while not losing the conservative votes for a long time.
Pro-life is one example. I personally would not vote for a pro-choice republican. Now until recently that wasn't even considered a possibility. Today though anything seems possible.
I think the only way for conservatives to prosper is to quit support moderates. And I'm not talking about Rhode Island Senators. I'm talking about presidents.
I agree that our current president has been fiscalling less than fully conservative. Inventing new departments and massive social programs is not conservative. Conservatives want departments shut down. But in all other areas he has been a solid conservative. So he's moderate fiscally (he did cut taxes) and fully conservative on all else. He does though seem to have a good grasp of the constitution. Bushes greatest achievement will be Roberts and Alito.
McCain though has liberal positions all over the place. I don't feel confident he'd nominate solid conservatives for justices. He'd nominate moderates. He might cut some spending (maybe) but he'd raise taxes. So he is left of Bush. But again I might accept left of Bush if he weren't so willing to slide the knife into my ribs and grin while doing it.
If I vote for McCain, I could never look a wife-beating victim in the eye again and tell her to leave her husband. The definition of insanity is try the same exact thing over and over again expecting a different result.
Arguing with these "moderates" will also get us nowhere. They think they are gaining ground to keep shifting with the political tides.
And maybe their popularity will content them for a season, but in 4 more years, 8 more years, 12 more years, as the results start to accumulate, they may someday experience some form of cognitive dissonance. If they aren't fully anesthetized in the meantime.
Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind. - Albert Einstein
since he got into the Houston market in either 1989 or 1990.
I will continue to listen to rush and respect him and his tremendous success.
And I will also continue ot think for myself and remain independent. I do not agree at all with his take on McCain or the state of the Republican Party.
Rush is welcome to his position, but I think he has gone off for a long walk on a short pier on this issue.
I will still listen and still like him. It is not the first time I have disagreed with him, and I am sure it will not be the last. This issue is a bit more high profiled than others, but so be it.
He is the Great Maha Rushdie, but he is still merely human.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
7 years. And how could you not agree that the state of the GOP is not presently, nor not very often over the past 7 years, dominated by conservatism.
Rush has not said he will not support McCain over the Dem, and I can guarantee you he will. He is an institution. Unlike us, who can turn on dimes from writing a scathing attack on McCain today and then endorsing him tomorrow. It take a while to turn Titanics. We are fleas.
Rush has also said that he does not now, nor has he ever, as he said in 2006, subscribe to the "win by losing" strategy.
I know the clues.
He has speculated that a McCain presidency "could" be the death of the GOP as the vessel for conservatism.
He has not written the obituary, and to the contrary, today he set out a possible congressional strategy to prevent same.
Now, see what I mean?
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Thanks for clarifying the question.
What I am saying is this:
Rush is an institution, but he is not a leader. He is a talk show host. He has never been elected to anything. He will not run for office. He is a genius commentator. He is not a genius leader.
I am pleased to hear he is not falling into the winning-by-losing death rattle. However he did say himself at one point things that could be reasonably supporting that idea.
What I have said before and I still believe, is that if conservatism was as popular as we wish it was, this debate would not be occurring. It would have been won awhile ago.
This years top three candidates, Huckabee, McCain and Romney, are all relatively moderate conservative candidates. None of them were 'democrat-lite'. The only real hard core conservatives, like Tancredo and Hunter, faded quickly after never catching on. That should be a hint to us all. Those pushing border issues as top priority are not winning very dramatically.
I care about the border and immigration reform a lot. I live in Houston, Texas. It is not an idle issue. It is impacting me and my family every day literally. But it is not turning elections, and the local talk show guys who focus on that issue in a big way are not taken seriously. The issue has not matured yet. And while McCain's stand on that so far has been in many ways unacceptable, at least he keeps us in the game and keeps far worse alternatives out. Do not forget what Clinton did for 1996 - conferring citizenship without regard to normal procedure or even law. Clinton will do it in spades in the future.
Rush, Ann, Savage, Laura, etc, etc, need to wake up and realize that the stakes are not reduced to programming notes. We are not a nation run by listenership poll numbers.
We have elections, and only those who win the elections get to write the laws.
If someone lets the other side write the laws, that is their choice. A very bad choice, imho.
I am not sure if that is the specificity you want, but at least it is a shot.
hard core conservative...Hunter, faded quickly... and then supported Huckabee
I support Governor Mike Huckabee for President.
I hear in my head :) yes, you should be an editor.
___________________________________________________________
Molon Labe!
I think you just might be my crack dealer.
You just keep pulling me back in here and you are even making me think about the wisdom, or lack thereof, of all these temper tantrums. Mine included.
is bubble gum cut and paste two non related quotes to
wait
he does rock here
he uses a semantic device to stir us up
I do this all the time.
Rock on!
as long as one remembers
Rush is Right!
Look at what Rush actually said.
The right, the object of countryclubber pro-choicers marginalization attempts since Reagan
that's what Rush said
and its true
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
his head at normal size and from being scattered around his walls and small animals!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Don't worry gc, my wife keeps my head the right size! I confess I don't get the small animals joke though.
I hope your love for me knows some bounds, though. Otherwise things are going to be awkward at next year's CPAC. ;)
Oh yeah, we're going. I'll pay if I have to. Maybe we can get EPU to meet us there.
absentee
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
wall when the head goes kaboom!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
We have a dog, however I'm a cat person.
I know, I know! One more reason I'm a little off-script.
absentee
how much I love and respect you (and Doc too, but don't tell him), but now you have let it slip out. But I promise not to take it out of context, eg 'tee is a cat person, but no, dawgs never attack cats. o no.
smile
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
_to CPAC! :( you win sir, I will slink away :)
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Molon Labe!
Well Doc I know gamecock outside of work so it's only natural. Meet me for coffee, then we'll talk about going on holiday!
absentee
Although I was in London about 18 months ago or so. Hit Luxembourg for the first time in 07, lovely little town ... err country.
absentee
my latest trip was Spain, now I am all about it. I tend to favor the Med countries, but if I have not been there, i want to go:)
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Molon Labe!
nice standard of living there.
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Molon Labe!
Great Britain and Northern Ireland, if I must be formal.
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Molon Labe!
get in a rumble, I'll take you with me and let nature take its course!
we'll call it holliday holiday
I got your back
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
hoped you would help diffuse the argument in the other thread, but you can't be everywhere I guess. It is cool how so many of you guys know each other, I am a loner here, my non virtual friends do not blog :)
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Molon Labe!
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
take the MahaRUSHis name in vain to you, I know all about those NC pool halls :)
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Molon Labe!
co-counsel to defend Rush in this defamation action. I have watch The Panel.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
1. He is always right.
2. He is never wrong.
3. There ain't no more rules.
'nough said.
A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have. Thomas Jefferson
My answer to GC became too long, so I turned it into an article HERE.
kryptonite....
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Finally there is an Obama Attack Ad that Points out that the guy has never taken a stand on an important issue!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywhZFjb_lng
-Hope means truth
Go ahead, make your jokes, Mr. Jokey... Joke-maker. But let me hit you with some knowledge. Quit now.
-White Goodman
All the "would have been", "might have been", "could have been" whining I have done myself when Rudy crashed and burned. The FredHeads need to take a crash course in reality. Do they really think McCain=Hillary=Obama. OK.
Elect a Democrat and these 4 resign within 4 years.
John Paul Stevens: Age 87.
Ruth Joan Bader Ginsburg: Age 74.
Anthony McLeod Kennedy: Age 71.
David Hackett Souter: Age 68.
If you're really that bitter stay home, go to sleep and wake up on 1/20/09 to President Obama or Clinton(and maybe you'll get a twofer, a Dem/Lib fantasy)
By Ford, Reagan, and Bush#1. We never should have trusted that closet liberal Reagan.
If the Republican Party establishment is moving to the left they will in fact be leaving conservatives nehind just as the democrats moved left leaving their conservatives to find shelter in the Republican Party. If the Republican Party sounds like the Democrats then we are really not offering a real alternative to the creeping socialism of the democrats. Of the R's that ran for President just a couple were conservatives but did not catch on with voters.McCain and Huckaby are liberal Republicans and both have records to support that contention.Besides defense immigration is our biggest problem that needs to be fixed and yet McCain's position and Hillary/Obama are the same.Open borders is going to be the death of the Party but also the country.
The more conservatives that we can elect to the House and Senate will be the only brake we will have on whoever is in the White House.
He is a conservative Republican, and has the record to prove it.
I support Governor Mike Huckabee for President.
A democrat that runs as a republican and has a few conservative positions.
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"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
I think a man who has succeeded in limiting state government, shifted the tax burden from income to consumtive taxes in his state, has a Duncan Hunter and Jim Gilchrist approved border security plan, endorses the FairTax, and has the communicative chops to sell it ... is a Republican through and through.
I support Governor Mike Huckabee for President.
Yeah, why the plural?
The only "limits" he put on the government of Arkansas were what he could get away with. Taxes went up, big time, over his period in office, both in absolute terms and relative to other states. He is soft on crime, soft on national security and soft on the GWOT.
But he is against abortion. Never going to do anything about it . . . but he's against it.
Is that all it takes to be a conservative?
Quentin Langley
Editor of http://www.quentinlangley.net
International Editor of
Quentin Langley
Editor of http://www.quentinlangley.net
International Editor of
Just have to say...
Gamecock is right on this one. Rush is right.
The "Rockefeller Republicans" along with the MSM have been trying to marginalize us for years. TRYING. He does go on to make the point that they haven't or we wouldn't be being courted by so many recently.
His rants haven't been nearly as caustic as Coulter's though.
And, telling us to STFU makes us feel like we're being marginalized. I agree we need to tone it down and not let the media over play it, but to not give us a voice of dissent at all does marginalize us.
It is still February. Give us the time we need to lick our wounds before saying "the door is to the left."
One last point, Rush went on and on today about the need to work diligently on the Congress races and even on more local races. More than just the Presidential race is at stake here.
the election is still none months away. Nine months -- the same length of time it takes to carry a baby to term. The caller suggested that the reason it takes so long is that it takes that long to prepare for a new life.
There is an analogy there...
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
I didn't suggest taking a door or S'ing TFU. My third to last paragraph was a suggestion to take David Limbaugh's advice, which is found here. If you read that, you'll see it's not about McCain.
I don't want people hearing "the pary is against us" and leaving the party or giving up.
absentee
it. I defend people in the right and ask for zippy. I was attacked in another thread, and only you defended me, thanks for that. Anyway, your argument stands for itself, you are at the top because people here agree with you. There is no future in bemoaning reality, we need to win or we will lose. Someone recently talked about "bashing opposing candidates" but that commentary was $2 short and 2 weeks late.
The reality is we have our candidate, and we can either defend him or destroy ourselves. If Rush wants us to destroy ourselves to support him, then he is no longer of use. We have men and women in harms way, risking more than we are here. We owe them a chance of victory.
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Molon Labe!
I am so torn. The reality is that "incrimination by association" exists and we conservatives will suffer from such under a McCain administration. McCain will walk the talk, but not walk the wald. People are going to believe that his tax increases and other liberal objectives are conservative.
On the other hand, I can't imagine the war of terror being conducted under Clinton or Obama.
In the end, I will likely vote for McCain. I may affirm him on the air in those few areas he is strong. But I will have a hard time providing much enthusiasm.
Kevin Price is Host of the Houston Business Show (M-F at 11 AM on CNN 650), Publisher of the HoustonBusinessReview.com and writes frequently in his www.BizPlusBlog.com.
You are right that in American politics, there is such a thing as "incrimination by association." Lots of people are saying that we have to retain the White House this year because of the US Supreme Court.
But it is very likely that if McCain wins this year, the Democrats will win in 2012. And by then, we will have had to have gone through another mid-term election in which the Democrats will pick up more Senate and House seats.
So, I actually think it could be to the GOP's and the nation's advantage to lose this year and be able to win in 2010 and comeback in 2012.
The fact is that Republicans who are elected president along side a Democrat Congress are usually not reelected and are usually ineffective at pushing the conservative agenda. Examples are Nixon/Ford and George H W Bush. Sure, we held off the Democrat president for another 4 years, but all that mean was that the nation drifted to the Left when the Republican was president and for another 4 years when the Democrat was elected president.
Sometimes losing the White House is the best thing that the GOP can have happen to it. Carter in 76 and Clinton in 92. 4 years after Carter we had the Reagan Revolution and 2 years after Clinton we had the Gingrich revolution.
Holding the White House without holding Congress usually just allows the Left's agenda to go through labeled as "conservative."
We only know anything about this election.
Your scenario is way too complex and way too friendly for Conservatives.
Look around the world at how much power the truly Conservative parties have. Almost none. That is the future if we decline to work in our large tent coalition.
After Johnson we got Medicare and Nixon. I'm not ready to risk it.
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"If we want to take this party back, and I think we can someday, let’s get to work." – Barry Goldwater
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
All I can say, to Rush and the whole crowd of "conservative opinion leaders", is in reference to Mitt Romney's purchase of Clear Channel Communications, through Bain Capital, Bain's control of Regnery Publishing, and their close relationship with Fox News.
Guys, when a candidate tries to "buy the printing press", in order to control information, you end democracy. And in the process, every single one of the 99% of conservative commentators and pundits who lined up behind Mitt Romney is turned into nothing more than shills, propagandists for one man. And I do not apologize for saying so. You were bought and paid for, and your credibility was devastated. Not beyond repair, but pretty close.
Think about it, the next time someone uses their wealth to buy control of the most critical instruments of political and cultural free expression.
Belisarius of Jerusalem, and of Constantinople
that he was the second gunman on the grassy knoll. Sure he was only a child, but what a disguise.
Conspiracy Theory 101 is over at myDD.
Do conservatives no longer care about what the voters want?
It is apparent that Rush and others have made things worse for conservatism rather than better.
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"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
My comment was to those who think that they are being marginalized by the Party.
Excellent article.
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"The perfect is the enemy of the good."
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
here on RS. I just wonder if its the natural (and necessary for human civilization counterweight to the also necessary male desires to win) female desire to resolve conflicts?
Or is it simply that you have just as fierce a love for Bush as I do for Rush?
Or is it....?
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
Rnc has been attacked with emails phone calls and letters against John (mexican) Mccain. We agree with Rush
NEVER, NEVER NEVER NEVER, EVER WILL WE CAST A VOTE FOR ANTI AMERICAN, MEXICO LOVING MCCAIN, PERIOD. WE WILL WI RTE IN A CANDIDATE IF WE MUST, HOPEFULLY ROMNEY/ HUNTER, OR THOMPSON IS STILL ON OUR BALLOTS. NEVER VOTING MCCAIN, WE WON'T BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DESTRUCTION OF THIS COUNTRY AND ALLOW THEM TO TURN US INTO A THIRD WORLD SANCTUARY NATION, PERIOD. YOU SUPPORT THIS IDIOT. WE REFUSE TO ,
INDEPENDENT TEXAS VOTER, AND WE ALWAYS VOTE
TAKE PRO AMNESTY , MCCAIN AND STICK HIM WHERE THE SUN DON'T SHINE
HTML Help for Red Staters
"If we want to take this party back, and I think we can someday, let’s get to work." – Barry Goldwater
One of the things I disagree with McCain on is his comprehensive illegal alien position. Basically, I think McCain supports amnesty. However, even I will say that the tone of the tirade above is ... well ... xenophobic.
even the worst of the GOP is better than HillBama. I'm not a McCain fan one bit, but if we can't agree on beating the Dems, who wish to do evil upon our country, then we're screwed. America doesn't deserve that.
When McCain is the Prez, true conservatives will be able to complain and get heard to some extent because he owes us for his election. When Barillary is president, we won't even have a seat at the table. 50% is better than 0%. This should be a no-brainer. Rush will come around.
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Halls of Justice Painted Green, Money Talking.
Power Wolves Beset Your Door, Hear Them Stalking.
The people who declare to the world that Rush is wrong about something NEVER listen to his show on a consistent basis. I am reading this thread and Absentee, the hero of this thread, the guy who seems to think he is pretty bright proves my point again. He gives us this big write up about Rush being off base and what do we finally get from him:
"I don't listen to the show, but this quote was the thrust of something he posted on his site. "
Once again we have some dude attempting to impress us by slapping down Rush only to find out they don't really listen to Rush. These people take a quote they read and then go with it... totally clueless to the big picture that Rush was painting for an hour or three hours on his show. Absentee is just another person who thinks he is actually smarter than Rush. Sorry, but Rush has 20 million listeners and 20 years of being correct for a reason. He is the ultimate conservative who is not willing to sell out his principals for a guy who simply has an R after his name.... uh... that would be McCain.
Next time listen to the show and get some context absentee. You sound like every other MSM donk who tries to take Rush down after " reading " something.
Rush is the one guy who is consistent year after year after year. He knows McCain is a liberal and he also knows the GOP is going left by people who push a guy like McCain.
Now the bad news. McCain is going to get blown out come November because watered down, liberal leaning, gutless, global warming pushing Republicans have no chance to win. Rush sees it and he is simply pointing out reality.
RINO's suck
Well I just wrote another blog the other day about not listening to Rush, so it wasn't really being kept in a lockbox.
But honestly, slapping down? Smarter than? Sell out his principals?
And who puts "reading" in quotes? Is that derisive? You and your so-called reading.
I admit it, I read. Call the cops.
I'll tell you what never fails when you talk about Rush. People who aren't objective start screaming about bashing and McCain when they obviously didn't get the point of the blog. It has nothing to do with Rush criticizing McCain.
Seriously. "Read" the blog next time and you might get some context.
absentee ... Little "a", little "bsentee"
absentee's opinion is quite well respected around here. People may not agree with him all of the time, but it is hard to argue that he doesn't reason his way to his argument. His use of reason is ample proof that his is not every other MSM donk.
Fighting for conservatism one day at a time.
The people who declare to the world that Rush is wrong about something NEVER listen to his show on a consistent basis.
So, people who do listen to his show on a consistent basis NEVER believe (or at least never declare) that he is wrong about anything? That may say something about Mr Limbaugh's persuasive abilities, but it doesn't say much for the cognitive skills of his audience.
Here's a rule of thumb for you: if two people always think alike, only one of them is actually thinking.
If the two people are you and Rush, bub, you aren't the one who is thinking.
Quentin Langley
Editor of http://www.quentinlangley.net
International Editor of
that's the question on everyone's mind
excellent job, absentee... again