MoveOn/NYT Ad Proof of Lying BUUUUUSSTTTTEEDDDDD
By Common Cents Posted in Archived — Comments (38) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
Promoted from diaries by Mark I.
After the disgusting ad posted which "coincidentally" happened to be published on Sept 10, the same day Petraeus was testifying, the NYT tries to cover up the discount by saying that discounted ad rate was open to anyone giving them a 7 day window to publish any day the NYT saw fit.
If that was the case why did the very last line of the ad text say:
"Today, before Congress and before the American people, General Petraeus is likely to become General Betray Us."
Why did the text say TODAY if they didn't know what day it would be published?
Why didn't the ad text read "On September 10, ..."?
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
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Suuurrrrre! I believe the Times!
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Dude, that's such a red-handed bust that I could not believe it until I checked it out for myself (http://pol.moveon.org/petraeus.html). With that the ACU ought to have an open an shut case. Awesome catch!
John E.
Here's my concern. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Rudy place his add in the NYT with the same discount? Can this come back to bite Rudy?
Rudy said he was running standby but that if it did not run on Thurs. then he did not want it to run at all. Taranto points out that this kind of thing makes a bit of a mockery of the whole supposed discount scheme. But anyway, I have been trying to find out if Rudy's ad did actually run in the NYT on thursday. Does anybody know?
John E.
Thanks. Also found this http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/14/us/politics/14paper.html?ex=1347422400... "Mr. Giuliani, a Republican presidential candidate, sought — and received — space in Friday editions of the newspaper for an advertisement in which he praises General Petraeus."
And in contradistinction to the NYT claim found in the AdAge article
Catherine Mathis, a spokeswoman for the Times, said the paper does not set or adjust rates based on the political content of any ads. "The advertising department, they don't see the ad before the rate is quoted," she said. "There is an individual who is in charge of advertising acceptability, but our acceptance or rejection of an ad does not depend on whether it coincides with our editorial page's positions. There are many instances when we have published opinion advertisements that run counter to the stance we take on the editorial pages."there is this from http://www.spectator.org/dsparticle.asp?artid=12023
The New York Times in the past has rejected "advocacy" ads from Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, as well as from the National Right to Life Committee, despite the fact that both would have qualified for the same "special advocacy, stand by" rates that the radical, left-wing organization MoveOn.org was given for its smear ad of Gen. David Petraeus... The Times claimed that MoveOn was given no special treatment, but several organizations that sought to place ads in a similar manner in past years have been turned away or were told that the ads were bumped for higher paying ads.
(h/t) http://wwwwakeupamericans-spree.blogspot.com/2007/09/rudy-giuliani-ad-in...
John E.
one will need the underscores that filtered html here interprets as a wish for italics. I have never been able to figure out how to prevent it from mangling links which contain underscores.
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=12023
John E.
I ran your URL thru http://www.tinyurl.com and came up with this:
No underscores, and it's nice and short.
...when they see me they'll say, "There goes Loren Wallace,
the greatest thing to ever climb into a race car."
Only after the NY Times got backed into a corner with the reality of their complicity in the attack on the General.
They knew they got caught with their hand in the cookie jar. Allowing Rudy's add was a way of doing damage control.
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System.out.println("An argument is a sequence of statements aimed at demonstrating the truth of an assertion.); }
Yes, if being backed into a corner means their sales group received another check for $65K, their standard stand-by rate.
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Does the NYT require that the fixed copy be in hand during the entire 7-day period? If not, then here's the defense: MoveOn.org was not guaranteed it would run on the 10th, but if it did not, they would have had the opportunity to change the copy to reflect that.
So I don't think it's open and shut just yet, but by all means, I hope the ACU is notified of this if they don't know about it already.
On the Rudy question, no, I don't think it will be a problem for him. Remember, the NYT is trying to manufacture for themselves the semblance of credibility on this. So if Rudy paid for the standby rate then I'm sure his ad would really have been placed in the standby queue. My guess is that he chose not to pay the standby rate, actually.
yes. If you buy an ad on standby the paper/mag has to have the ad proof on hand when you place the order.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
they could gave given the NYT two versions. In this electronic era that's a no-brainer.
Emails, paper trails, computer files, phone records, corroborating tesimony... And BTW, what's this got to do with the first admenment which you have always used as a shrowd of secrecy?
John E.
I'm surprised that I missed that. I'm glad somebody didn't. Good job.
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there could be a logical explanation. Suppose they had submittted let's say three versions of it, one if it ran on day 1-3, another if it ran on 4-6, and another if it ran on day 7 of the window.
I hate giving the benefit of the doubt to known liars, but it's possible nothing nefarious took place in this particular regard.
Don't you think the NYT would have trotted out the different ad copies by now to cover their trail? They might suddenly come up with them now in the age of electronica but they didn't come out with them right after they got busted.
Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you. Washington Elected Elite
The excuse will be that Moveon.org simply changed the final copy for the deadline of the day. They bought space, not a specific message.
Will the NYT use that excuse under oath, or in a sworn deposition?
It's not the crime that gets you in the end, it's the coverup...
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first, I have no doubt that Moveon signed a contract for a space available ad.
Given the text on the ad what is hard to believe is that the ad actually ran on that basis.
My first thought was that this was a convenient stick to beat the NYT with but that it was overblown. On further examination it looks like the NYT did deeply discount the ad to Moveon.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
Much easier to just print "On Sept. 10......"
Printing "Today......" doesn't enhance the story at all.
NYT, Los Angeles Times, Atlanta Constitution and Urinal, Pretty much more of the same, 1st Amendment, 4th estate, freedom, liberty, all suffer threat when these writers take testimony of patriots like General Patraeus and find more fiction than Steven King, but then even puppies learn early, "do it on the paper", but I suppose that's a fitting tribute to most of what is written.
The benefit to being a liberal (for those who are willing to admit it) is that it requires nothing of you, no commitment, no truth, no standards and certainly no accountability. The left has no standards, it's the very essence of being "liberal", the theory of relativity takes on a whole new meaning. If behavior fails to meet the conventional standard, change the standard, not the behavior. Clinton (the taller man of the two) mastered this corrupt art form, if the truth is not suitable,...change the meaning of truth, lie, "is"...
Most of the egg heads that one meets after an overdose of humanities courses, couldn't find decency or integrity if they formed a search party. Not all of them, and I say this out of conscience, I know one guy that calls himself a liberal, (I think he's more of a closet conservative held as a professional hostage by the NEA)
What can we do, I'm profoundly grateful to all the great men and women that serve our nation with honor, and protect my right to write, to think and to express,...be it in Latin, English, and sometimes profanity in Spanish (I only know the bad words) Later, Greg
"Res Ipsa Loquitor." --Whoever thoughtitup
Does it make any difference to you folks that the 'betrayus' thing did not originate with MoveOn? Or that the name is actually in common use by troops in Iraq? Or that Petraeus' commander considers him to be something less than a stellar representative of military steadfastness?
Just curious
large pile of the vile stuff has just been left on the livingroom rug. It's going to leave a spot!
Both side now would be BOTH Democrat and al Qaeda?
Tell me is there just you typing really rapidly or are there more ?
Do you have any cites for your claims or is speaking out of orifices not normally used for the purpose amongst your talents.
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You'd think upon returning you might try talking out your mouth instead of the other orifice. Or at least providing some sources for your assertions.
______________________________
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/23/opinion/23pubed.html?_r=2&n=Top/Opinio...
NYT public editor Clark Hoyt did an internal investigation and found that NYT violated it's own policies.
Sounds like they are playing dumb saying "we made a mistake" and a sales person could be sacrificed. I doubt a sales person could make that kind of discount decision.
I say don't let up until a higher up gets canned for this and there is a public apology page one.
Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you. Washington Elected Elite
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