Major Huckabee Endorsement

By GOP84 Posted in Comments (95) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »

Alright folks, if you thought that Ric Flair and Chuck Norris were big, just wait until you hear who has endorsed Mike Huckabee now:

God.

That's right. Mike Huckabee has declared that Divine providence is responsible for his surge in the polls in Iowa. Apparently Romney and Huckabee are not in dead heat in Iowa. According to Huckabee, God has already declared him the victor there.

This endorsement just might overshadow Romney's religious speech this week.

Stay tuned as we keep you updated on the latest concerning this Earth-shattering endorsement.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

______________________________
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

If Huckabee really said that, I am going to puke.

And scroll 3/4 of the way down the page.

From the Liberty University link Jerimy provided further down this thread, this is a juicy one:

In a brief question-and-answer period after his talk, one student asked Huckabee what he can attribute the surge in success to. Huckabee replied: "There’s only one explanation for it and it’s not a human one. It’s the same power that felt that … two fish and five loaves could feed a crowd of 5,000 people."

Liberty University

Right: preview, preview; and don't forget to test the link before posting :-P

OK, first of all the link you've provided doesn't give the exact question that the student asked. The Liberty University webpage, while a decent source of information about all things related to Liberty University, is not a recognized news source.

Second, the article recapitulated the question as follows: "one student asked Huckabee what he can attribute the surge in success to." Needless to say, the "surge in success" could refer to Huckabee's "surge in the polls," but it might just as well refer to Huckabee's successful political career in general. Without the context, and most importantly the exact question the student asked, the meaning of Huckabee's response is not clear.

DISCLAIMER: I am not a Huckabee supporter. I am considering Huckabee, along with several other candidates, but I remain undecided concerning who I will vote for.

Hang all traitors and secessionists! Hang them high!
- Me

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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.

I certainly do not support Huckabee's candidacy and hope he isn't our guy. But this is a mountain of a molehill. I credit divine providence for my current job as well. God has blessed me and I don't mind saying so.

How is this different? Or different from a boxer thanking God for his victory?

Seems awfully silly to extrapolate as you have done. A frivolous non-starter of a criticism if you ask me.

absentee

If what Huck said is along the lines of "I think God for being here and giving me the strength and skills to carry on ..." then yes, this is probably an "Oy veh" moment - as my first comment indicates.

But there is also the possibility (even if slight) that what GOP84 is driving at - God wants ME to win!! - was what was said. That would be, well, surprising of course, but also pretty newsworthy.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

However, I want Huckabee to recognize "divine providence" if he loses Iowa. Does he really think that God wants him to win? Without clarifying his statement, it sounds like he thinks he has God's stamp of approval.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

Even if ... so what? The only way it matters a whit is if he is suggesting that God wants us to vote for him over others. IF he simply says, I think God blesses my candidacy, or I'm doing what God wants me to do ... so what? God may wish him to surge in the polls and lose. Judging by his character alone, I have no doubt he will consider a loss God's will, as any real Christian would.

And may I say I fervently hope we have the opportunity for him consider the implications of a loss. He's one of my bottom 3 along with Paul and Hunter.


absentee

Mr. Huckabee also said that Divine providence was responsible for his recent surge in the polls in Iowa, as he noted that he is the candidate with much less capital firepower than his rivals.

I am extremely interested in seeing a transcript from this speech.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

I'm not a director, but if I were, I'd give you the infamous 500-word assignment on "providence". (And no, writing on that city in Rhode Island will not do.)

It really is a good idea when addressing an educated and reasoning group of readers to look up the definitions of words you don't know the meaning of rather than to just go and create your own definition to advance your cause.

I you had, you'd have realized as the previous commenters have stated that there's nothing here to look. I've got lots of problems with Huckabee, but his referring to divine providence" is not one of them.

And Rightly So!

of the word "providence." No need for any lesson from you. I'd appreciate it if you didn't patronize me.

Even if Huck could be given the benefit of the doubt here, his statement was irresponsible and open to interpretation from the people that would eventually see it.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

You're just looking in every little nook and cranny in order to discredit Huckabee.

We know you don't like the man because people who used to support your candidate are beginning to flock to him in droves, I just wish you'd admit it when you bloviate.

This is coming from the guy that considers a handful of polls a month before the election in Iowa to be a "miracle."

Come on, J Map. Huckabee-Paul '08. You know you want it.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

Don't Lump Voldemort in with that Loon Huckabee!
Huckabee supporters and ideas are CCCrazzzzzzyyyyy.

Voldemort supporters and ideas are only crazzzzyyy.
:)

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"The bass, the rock, the mic, the treble, I like my coffee black, just like my Metal." - MSI

So then, if Providence is God's working out his purposes through "ordinary" means, then Huck is by no means stating the words you so blithely put in his mouth, to wit:

Apparently Romney and Huckabee are not in [a] dead heat in Iowa. According to Huckabee, God has already declared him the victor there.

This is an utter non-sequitur from what the linked article paraphrases him as saying. There's nothing in his appeal to divine providence which implies that Huck is claiming that God has already annointed him the victor.

And Rightly So!

Think about it. Saying that divine providence is responsible for Huck's success in Iowa is saying that God has led him to this point in poll numbers right?

Would God be setting Huck up for a fall, should he lose Iowa?

This isn't a matter of me putting words in Huckabee's mouth as much as it Huckabee putting words in God's mouth.

And that's not a position I want to be in if I'm Mike Huckabee.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

While Mike Huckabee feels encouraged by the polls and trusts that God's providence is behind it and hopes it will lead to an electoral victory, there's nothing theological or otherwise in an appeal to providence that leads to a prophecy of victory. Indeed, to have heard the voice of God or to otherwise claim a knowledge of the election outcome would precise represent a departure from providence and enter into the realm of divine revelation.

And Rightly So!

I'm so glad you could explain Mike Huckabee and his views on divine providence for me. Do you work for him? Because somebody needs to clarify these statements for him.

Let me do a little clarifying of my own: I think it's irresponsible to consider poll number success and popularity to be "divine providence."

If the case can be made that Huck's "success in Iowa" is "divine providence," I guess we'd have to say that Britney Spears' album sales are also divine providence.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

No, I don't work for Huckabee - indeed he's 4th or 5th on my list. You do raise the key question as to what Huckabee meant by divine providence. I thought "providence" had a rather precise theological definition that was widely understood, but from what I reading here, I do seem to be wrong on the "widely understood" - and thus perhaps also wrong that it has a "precise definition".

By my definition of providence stated above, (=God's working his puposes through ordinary means), almost everything that comes to pass represents divine providence. Thus to attribute the recent events to divine providence was essentially an "of course" and simply publically acknowledging God's role in the world and in his life.

But your comments and others' suggest that the word is more open to various interpretations of meanings than I thought - and that thus Huckabee may have meant or implied something more dramatic than what I've thought.

Your second paragraph is well stated, in that it is not good judgment on Huckabee's part, or even presumptuous, if Huckabee were trying to say that poll numbers and popularity were sings of God's particular favor towards his candidacy. And to say that publically in a way that could be open to such an interpretation was irresponsible. God is not a respecter of persons.

I indeed view prosperity theology as anathema to Christian faith. Your third paragraph just highlights the absurdity of viewing sales or popularity as evidence of divine favor.

And a leader who operates by vox populi, vox dei is a very dangerous political figure in a constitutional republic.

And Rightly So!

Frankly, I don't disagree with your interpretation of providence. It's practically the same as mine.

I definitely believe that God works in the lives of mankind during these times. I'm not a deist like Thomas Jefferson was. However, that having been said, I try to speak where God has spoken and try to silent where God is silent.

Too often I think many people flippantly interject God's approval or disapproval into situations that may or may not concern Him. And that is the contention I have with Huckabee claiming "divine providence," as the reason for his success in poll numbers.

On the flip-side, I wouldn't say that God is definitely not working in this election. That would also be irresponsible.

In short, I let God speak for Himself. He has a plan that I, with a finite human mind cannot always understand.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

I try to speak where God has spoken and try to remain silent where God is silent.

We humans would keep ourselves out of a lot of our self-inflicted troubles if more of us kept that in mind.

And Rightly So!

Not everyone puts the [a] on the phrase "in dead heat."

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

I thus had a hard time thinking of two male Presidential candidates in dead heat. Now if you'd been talking about Hillary...

And Rightly So!

Okay, I must say you got me there. Now we've just got to get Fox News to get on board.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

I'm not a director, but if I were, I'd give you the infamous 500-word assignment on "providence". (And no, writing on that city in Rhode Island will not do.)

It really is a good idea when addressing an educated and reasoning group of readers to look up the definitions of words you don't know the meaning of rather than to just go and create your own definition to advance your cause.

I you had, you'd have realized as the previous commenters have stated that there's nothing here to look. I've got lots of problems with Huckabee, but his referring to divine providence" is not one of them.

And Rightly So!

And yet now he's in 1st in Iowa. Is that not a miracle?

considering the serious imbalance in regard to finances?
consider the serious imbalance in regard to paid campaign staff?
considering the incredible divergence in "establishment" party-officials support?
considering the huge divide in regard to name recognition counting back to early August?

Seriously, I think we need to get a grip here. Huckabee wasn't saying he was the only candidate God wanted elected, or saying anything of the sort. To count your success to a miracle, or to God's great providence (which so many people don't understand these days), or to thank God for his favor in any regard is something that should be greatly accepted in this country- and should be seen for only what it is.

Or are you going to argue that JF Kerry going from something like 8% in Iowa to winning about 9-days later in 2004 with 40% of the caucus was also a "miracle"?

Talk about needing to get a grip.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

Just about all of those in the Democratic establishment had already cast their support for Kerry. That was no miracle in the least as Dean, Gephardt and Edwards hurt each other enough for Kerry to swing past them with the establishment's support. After NH, the MSM picked it up and was over.

On the other side, Huckabee has No personal fortune, No incredible connections, No large campaign staff, No series of bankrolled pundits, He didn't run any ads until last week in Iowa. He doesn't even have a speechwriter on his staff!

By all means of establishing who should be a "first-tier" candidate by political-campaign-strength standards, Huckabee would be your last choice.

For Huckabee to humbly account his success to Providence, rather than his incredible retail-campaigning skills, sense of humor, or ability to connect with the issues low and middle-class Republicans care about, along with that of social conservatives I think is admirable. The ability to be humble is an attribute I think an individual vying for the most powerful position in the world should have.

Okay fine. Huck has a touching rags-to-riches political story that should warm the heart of every American, even Ted Kennedy.

I'm just curious, what will Huckabee say that God says if he loses Iowa? Will that be divine providence that he can be "humbled by" too? I sure hope so.

And really, he wasn't saying that God wanted him to President, he was just saying that God wanted him to win Iowa. In that case, it seems that the divine providence would fall in Rudy's favor.

So maybe that's what God wants: a Giuliani-Huckabee ticket.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

So are we to establish that we will be calling this era the "A.H." (as in, After Huck) era and everything prior to, say, August as the "B.H." (as in, Before Huck) era? Because, after all, mere political shifts in the wind couldn't possibly explain Huck's rise in Iowa, right?

For crying out loud, and to borrow a phrase (from you, after all), get a freaking grip, J Map.

This ain't Moses parting the waters sort of stuff, here.

As has been said by others, at least the Ronulans were just crazy.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

MOlsen6
Proud supporter of McCain '00 and McCain '08

Miracles are supernatural. I don't think Huckabee's poll numbers are the result of something that couldn't happen within the laws of nature or wasn't in the realm of possibility.

Sure, I think there is a place for crediting God with your success. But considering poll numbers and publicity to be "divine providence?" I'm not so sure.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

The point was that most of America could care less if individuals attribute success to a miracle or providence. One would be blind if he didn't say that Huckabee's current poll numbers and publicity show him to be successful. For Huckabee to be humble and attribute that to Providence is admirable.

If this is the best you nit-pickers can bring on Huckabee then your respective campaigns must really be desperate!

It is not a miracle. It is political opportunism. The field of candidates is considered weak by Iowa Republicans. You can appeal to a third of the Republican activists through your religiosity and anti-abortion stance for awhile. In a retail politics and caucus state, lots of money is not as important as showing up at meetings and charming the undecided. Huckabee will eventually show many flaws, just like the other candidates. Fred could have had this plurality, if he
had showed up earlier. When the Republican caucus gets its act together, they will start thinking about somebody who can win the state.

Christ raising Lazarus from the dead is a miracle.

Feeding the masses with 5 loaves and 2 fish is a miracle.

My cousin falling 3 or 4 stories on his head onto concrete and surviving is a miracle.

Indecisive Iowans deciding to go with one candidate over the other a month out before the actual caucus is a change of mind.

Unless, of course, we saw Kucinich and Paul win those and get springboarded to the nomination. If that happened, though, I'm pretty sure that is God's two-minute warning buzzer before the apocalypse.

Vos can't ledo astrum si vos intentio pro clouds

Formerly known as ShowMeConservatism. For more common sense conservatism, visit the Show Me Conservatism blog.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

This term is an integral part of John Calvin's theological framework known as Calvinism, which emphasizes the depravity of man and the complete sovereignty of God. God's plan for the world and every soul that he has created is guided by his will, or providence. According to Calvin, the idea that man has a free will and is able to make choices independently of what God has already determined is based on our limited understanding of God's perfection and the delusion that God's purposes can be circumvented. In this mode of thought, providence is related to predestination.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divine_Providence

with Calvin... :>)
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.

If you mean he believes we have free choice than I would say I think thats probably the case with all of the candidates. I don't know if there are very many people who don't believe in free choice, it seems like our ideas about life are somewhat centered around the idea of free choice. Anyway I was just curious how Huck's out of phase with Calvin.

I think overall Calvin was probably a good reformer, but I don't agree with him on the issue of free choice.

Check out the basic theology differences between Calvinists and SBC. Free choice is the biggest issue, but it's only one of 'em. They're about as close as SBC and RC. I'm not going to start or participate in another theology forum at Redstate. (Not sniping at you, just a statement.)
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.

1. Non-religious or non-praying people will present further caricatures of the religious--in the same manner that the secular liberals ridicule Bush for apparently believing he was called to the presidency.

2. In turn, expect alot of class-warfare, class-envy caricatures of the supporters of the pro-choice, pro-Roe, anti-tax Giuliani.

It's gonna get ugly. Once Iowa and NH suggest that it might come down to those two (if not sooner), it'll be better if we choose to rally behind McCain, Romney, or Thompson.

"People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to their ancestors." -Edmund Burke

Yes by bs

>>>it'll be better if we choose to rally behind McCain, Romney, or Thompson.<<<

You are absolutely correct. I'd take any of those three, in the following order:

Thompson
Romney
McCain

McCain is probably the most controversial of the bunch, but still electable.

The Huckabee thing just gets weirder every day. He must have been taking Paul pills.


The Unofficial RedState FAQ
“You are not only responsible for what you say, but also for what you do not say. ” - Martin Luther

Haha by GOP84

Paul pills, I like that.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

human understanding, including Huck's.

It doesn't mean you get a plum you like.

...in my catalog of "Over the Top" statements to pitch for a candidate. It'll sit right along side the various pro-Rudy rhetoric that claims the U.S. will be an Islamic nation inside of four years if we don't vote for Rudy.

So if Rudy loses - we're all dead,
but God wants Huckabee to win?

Man, I am going to have to work these two statements out.....LOL

of a Rudy supporter saying any such thing?

I'd like to see the quote.

If Huckabee thinks God is the reason he is now leading Iowa, then why is he doing push polling? I just saw on the realclearpolitics blog- there was a link that a group associated with Huckabee that was doing push polling.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/1207/Apparent_proHuckabee_t...

Look at what these kooks have had to say. Would you vote for these guys for President--who actually think they can discern God's "providence" (what a joke) in ordinary life?!?!?!?!?

"It is impossible for the man of pious reflection not to perceive in [the Constitution] a finger of that Almighty hand which has been so frequently and signally extended to our relief in the critical stages of the revolution.
James Madison--Federalist #37.

And look at this clown:

"With equal pleasure I have as often taken notice that Providence has been pleased to give this one connected country to one united people --a people descended from the same ancestors, speaking the same language,professing the same religion, attached to the same principles of government, very similar in their manners and customs, and who, by their joint counsels, arms, and efforts, fighting side by side throughout a
long and bloody war, have nobly established general liberty and
independence.

This country and this people seem to have been made for each other, and it appears as if it was the design of Providence, that an inheritance so proper and convenient for a band of brethren, united to each other by the strongest ties, should never be split into a number of unsocial, jealous, and alien sovereignties."

John Jay, Federalist #2.

And get a load of this nut:

If we shall suppose that American Slavery is one of those offences which, in the providence of God, must needs come, but which, having continued through His appointed time, He now wills to remove, and that He gives to both North and South, this terrible war, as the woe due to those by whom the offence came, shall we discern therein any departure from those divine attributes which the believers in a Living God always ascribe to Him?"
Abraham Lincoln. Second Inaugural.
And this one really get me:

"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes, and our sacred Honor."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

"People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to their ancestors." -Edmund Burke

Stare decisis is fo' suckas -- Feddie

devine providence was making the way for their election to public office...
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.

They claimed that collective action, not just individual action, was somehow guided by (if not blessed) by God. That would only multiply the allaged absurdity.

"People will not look forward to posterity who never look backward to their ancestors." -Edmund Burke

Come on folks, this is not serious. If you read the link, and have ever attended a Christian Fundamentalist service, this type of language is not uncommon. I would have hoped that "Red State" people would be much more familiar with this than the discussion seems to indicate. The man is fortunate, and this is his way of giving thanks, just like when a football player tells a reporter after a football game "Glory to God". I am very close to repeating other poster's comments.

I don't see what the thrill over Huckabee is all about. He is a nice and decent individual, with a reasonable amount of practical political experience albeit in a rather small and backwards state. He isn't terribly well educated, but is well spoken and is in touch with the attitudes of your average Southerner. He won't win, because he can not expand his base beyond Christian conservatives. Can anybody see the "Club for Growth" ever supporting this guy? Not I. How about other fiscal conservatives? Nope. So ... how does he get enough delegates? *Yawn* I tire of Huckamania ... he just doesn't bother me too much. They have to sell papers somehow ...

MOlsen6
Proud supporter of McCain '00 and McCain '08

If this is like saying "glory to God," what will the Huckster say about God when he loses Iowa? Will that be the same "divine providence?"

This is counting your chicks before they've hatched.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

GOP84,

Have you ever been to a Christian Fundamentalist church? Educate yourself. I'd know just where to send you in Columbus, OH or Amarillo, TX, but I don't think that would help. These people are an important component of the GOP electorate. Just visit for a Sunday. It doesn't take much time, and you don't have to believe anything you hear, but go for the experience of broadening your horizons. It will be the massive church with the GMs and Fords in the parking lot. If you see a whole bunch of Lexus or BMW, you got the wrong place. You might gain a better appreciation for Huckabee's language, but to understand the meaning might take some more time and certainly additional visits.

MOlsen6
Proud supporter of McCain '00 and McCain '08

MOlsen6,

I am a regular church-going evangelical Christian. Fundamentalist? I'm not so sure. And where I go, we've got everything from 1980's Buicks to 2007 Toyotas. Also, my church isn't massive. I don't buy into the whole mega-church phenomenon.

I'm well aware of Huckabee's language. That's why it bothers me. To point to flippant poll numbers and media notoriety and call it the providence of God is just silly! That's like Britney Spears claiming that providence of God helped her record sales!

If God is responsible for Huckabee's poll numbers, that would almost imply that the people being polled didn't have free will, which I don't quite believe. And if in fact God was responsible, do you think He'd be setting Huckabee up for the fall should he lose Iowa? What Huckabee said amounts to counting your chicks before they've hatched.

I let God speak for Himself, MOlsen6. I don't need Huckabee to do the speaking for Him.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

Is this the direction this presidential election is going to go? Because I think I might go crazy way before Iowa let alone November 08. You have Hilary digging up Obama's 3rd grade "documents" as dirt- and this snide remark in reference to speech made at a bible college- by an ex-minister.

Here are some direct quotes from Libery's website:
(http://www.liberty.edu/libertyjournal/index.cfm?PID=15758&ArtID=42)

When Liberty University Chancellor Jerry Falwell Jr. introduced Republican presidential candidate Gov. Mike Huckabee at Wednesday’s convocation, he said Huckabee told university leaders during a visit here last year that “if this candidacy really took off it would have to be a God thing.”

And, while the research continues to show Huckabee climbing in the polls, he said the “God thing” will continue to amaze those on the outside.

In a brief question-and-answer period after his talk, one student asked Huckabee what he can attribute the surge in success to. Huckabee replied: “There’s only one explanation for it and it’s not a human one. It’s the same power that felt that … two fish and five loaves could feed a crowd of 5,000 people. … There literally are thousands of people across this country who are praying that little would become much and it has.”

I'm still not seeing any proof as to what this blog post implies- Huckabee saying God has declared him the victor. All I see is something being made out of nothing which I haven't come across too often when visiting this site.

"Let us win. Let us win."

I wouldn't mind it so much if he had already actually WON. But he hasn't.

Does he credit Giuliani's vast lead in national polls to God's will as well?

Wow by GOP84

Excellent point. Was God with Romney up until a week or two ago? Will God be with whoever wins Iowa inevitably?

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

That Mass went from #5 to #4 in highest taxes and Ark went down in the rankings, under their respective tenures.

Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
http://thehinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
www.race42008.com
www.fred08.com

Doesn't Medved have to provide some data to back this up?

I've read the data on Romney as governor of Massachusetts. I don't see any sales tax rate increases or income tax rate increases.

I see both in Huckabee's tenure as governor of Arkansas.

As for spending, Romney kept the budget right at about the rate of inflation plus population growth. Romney issued about 800 vetos. Most of them overridden by a liberal legislature.

Huckabee allowed spending to grow 3 times as fast as the inflation rate.

I dare say that Arkansas Democrats in the legislature are more conservative than Massachusetts Democrats in the legislature.

I don't see how Huckabee is anything other than a "compassionate conservative" on steroids.

Combined State and Local Tax Burdens

  AR MA
Year Burden Rank Burden Rank
1997 10.1% 30
1998 10.2% 27
1999 10.2% 29
2000 10.5% 23
2001 10.5% 23
2002 10.3% 23
2003 10.0% 29 10.0% 32
2004 10.5% 15 10.2% 29
2005 11.2% 14 10.5% 27
2006 11.1% 13 10.5% 28
2007 11.3% 13

Source: Tax Foundation (which uses Dept of Commerce data)
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

Medved is flatly wrong. During Huckabee's 10 year term as Governor, Arkansas went from the 30th highest taxes, to the 13th, courtesy of taxfoundation.org. http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/442.html

As a comparison, When Clinton entered the Arkansas Governor mansion, the state had the 42nd highest taxes. When he left, the state had the 39th. It moved 3 places over 12 years. It then dropped 17 places over 10 during Huckabee's. I've been diligently searching, but I can find no equivalent comparative worsening in taxes over the last 10 years. It's just astonishingly bad.

During Mitt's 4 years, Mass went from 32nd to 28th. Even if we assume an equivalent drop projected out over 10 years (implausible given that almost all of the increase came during Romney's first year, due to various fee increases, and local tax increases to compensate for Romney's vast cuts to local funding), Romney's still considerably better on the issue. Leagues better.

I heard the Medved analysis, too. I don't remember the specific sources but he said he had two, I think from the government. I believe he said he was comparing the tax burden as a percentage of annual state income. He was quite persuasive and the difference between the Arkansas tax burden and Massachusetts' was stark. He criticized the Huck campaign for not responding with this data, citing the "unorganized", underfunded campaign.

Mr. Ed
Straight from the Horse's Mouth

Well by zuiko

If you are looking for tax burden as a percentage of income, look at my table a few posts up. That is obviously not what he was using because AR shot up from 30 to 13 (most of that in the same 4 years that Romney was running MA).
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

"tax burden as a percentage of annual state income"

I can't expect you to be able to recall from memory something you probably heard while you were driving, but that just doesn't make any sense. What is "annual state income"?

Zuiko has the numbers above for adjusted per-capita. I can tell you from looking at my own tax forms from 2003-2007 that state taxes were almost flat during that time period while local taxes increased somewhat steadily at about 4% per year.

If there were some reasonable, straighforward way to demonstrate that Huck really isn't as bad on taxes and spending as, well, virtually every FisCon says I'm sure it would have been put out there by now. Long ago, in fact.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

PS, I call BS on that unless he shows some real serious backup. My STATE taxes actually went slightly down during Mitt's reign - my local taxes (property, car) are what went up, and up, and up.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

Must not be measured as a % of income... in other words, they are totally meaningless.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

could have been making it up, for all I know.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

Huckabee made it up and Medved repeated it. Medved is a great guy but he's wrong about things often enough.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

citing Providence is an issue. Huck is playing to his base and at least in this instance, just being himself. Where I go ballistic is where he pretends to be conservative.

www.fred08.com
Redneck Hippi

Ugh...This is why I cannot stand this "Huckster" gov from Hope Ark...He HAS NO SHOT AT WINNING!!!!!! He would be best advised to leave the race and endorse someone.

Christopher C.

4 ahead of Romney. Perhaps Romney should drop out!

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

That is up from 10 last month.

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Diplomacy is the art of saying 'Nice doggie' until you can find a rock.

Unfortunately, wishing it's not true doesn't make him go away. We have five guys who can win at this point, easily.

Well, at least there's only about a month to go until the actual voting starts, and the tension can start to be relieved.

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Neil, he may be able to win the primary; but I don't see him winning over the moderate to secular independents we need to win in November.

And it'd be great to have a president with some coattails. I don't see Huckabee helping us where we need help.

(Again, I'll vote for the guy, if the Hucksters tone it down a bit)

I agree that he can't necessarily win the general election, because he has the same unity problem Giuliani has, but he can win the primary process, skewed as it is.

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As a Christian, I believe that all things are the result of divine Providence. Really, Huckabee's just acknowledging the existence of an all powerful God. That's not even Christian, per se, but general theism.

is that God is at work in the world around us. Things don't just happen by accident. God is at work every single moment of our lives. That is what MANY Christians believe. In fact, it is what many non-Christians believe. So, to say he believes that God is at work is not to say he thinks, "God wants him to win." In fact he said, "The last time I checked God wasn't registered to vote." That is not a response from someone who thinks God wants him to win.

However, it is not wrong to think that God is at work in one's campaign. Let me say this,"I hope God is working in the lives of our leaders." Otherwise, that is one scary thought.

I don't think this is any different than a football player thanking God after a win. They don't honestly believe God wanted their opponents to lose, they just are thanking the Almighty for blessing them, for being able to achieve what they have.

If not, the reverse would be true - i.e., "Jesus made me fumble." Or the modern corollary: "Saint Drogo made me lose Iowa."

"Jesus made me fumble."

I'm surprised nobody has said that yet.
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Underlying most arguments against the free market is a lack of belief in freedom itself. - Milton Friedman

There is quite a bit of difference between thanking God for your glories in life as well as your mistakes, and racking something up to divine providence. Divine providence is the equivalent of saying that God has not only blessed your mission, but is working actively to see it succeed.

Now, if Huckabee had said that he was where he was at by the grace of God, or that God was his source of strength in being able to get the numbers he has in IA, that would be different. It would be more to what you said. But, if the blog post is correct, then Huckabee explicitly said that it was due to divine providence. And, for a guy touted for his ability to speak clearly and known for his prior life as a minister and preacher, I would have trouble saying that it was Huckabee misspeaking.

GWB-yeah, you could attribute it to miscommunication-tegery. Huckabee? That's a tougher sell.

Vos can't ledo astrum si vos intentio pro clouds

Formerly known as ShowMeConservatism. For more common sense conservatism, visit the Show Me Conservatism blog.

There seem to be at least two basic definitions that people are operating under:

If you think Huck would define "divine providence" as God's working out his will through ordinary means, then there's nothing distrubing about Huckabee's statement; he's just giving acknowledgement to God.

However, if like Nick and GOP84 you believe Huck would define "divine providence" as indicating an active intervention of God on behalf of his candidacy, then yes this would be a troubling statement.

And the fact that politically-involved people like the RedState readership can't be sure as to which definition Huck subscribes is in itself a meta-problem. And if we can't figure this out, the bulk of American voters certainly can't figure this out, which leaves them vulnerable to the media's chosen interpretation.

The upshot is that having raised the matter, Huckabee needs to explain clearly what he means by divine providence, e.g. what he believes is God's attitude towards his candidacy.

And Rightly So!

An election in which foreign policy, terrorism, and toughness are likely to be dominant issues is not one that fits a former Arkansas governor with no foreign policy experience.

Could you Huckabee fans at least convince him to see an orthodontist? In a general election, hair and teeth matter.

Our founding Fathers believed it, that Huckabee believes it shouldn't be so controversial. However, I should say that if one considers a change in public opinion polls divine providence, you also have to say Steve Forbes' temporary rise to first in both Iowa and New Hampshire in late 1995-early 1996 before plumetting down to Earth to equally be divine providence.

Adam's Blog

 
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