Mark Foley Resigns

By Erick Posted in Comments (211) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »

Congressman Mark Foley (R-FL) has resigned from the United States House of Representatives over allegations that he was sending sexually explicit emails and IMs to male congressional pages and others.

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Proud to be: politically incorrect, straight, white, pro-life Christian, and of the opinion the spotted owl tastes just like chicken.

? by EliWho

...proud to be white?

Senator Byrd, is that you?

He's had that sig for ages, and you pick on it here and now?
If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots. racial pride limited to non-whites?
Just a rhetorical question. I despise racial pride & identity politics. But if it's okay for one group it should be okay for all.

"Suppose you were a congressman, and suppose you were an idiot. But I repeat myself." - Mark Twain

I just posted a blog about this as you were writing your post, apparently, having just seen the Drudge reference.

What Foley did wrong was create this scenario in the first place, and so close to the election that the RPOF probably can't get a good replacement candidate ready in time.

Is not a good day.

This RINO Rep Foley has been unveiled for who he always was. He was a media favorite because he fought his President & is liberal/moderate.

Recall he dropped from GOP primary for US Senate race earlier this cycle or last. The political insiders heard of rumors he was a homosexual even then. But, he could not win any statewide primary race as the "moderate" Bush-opposing RINO anyway.

He flirts then drops before he loses. Now, he's finally gone.

Tim Mahoney. And the Dems magic number falls to 14.

Today is not a good day.

If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

=Tony LaRussa?

Both were made famous by the bay. Maybe both will collapse epically down the stretch this fall.

I know in my heart that man is good. That what is right will always eventually triumph. And there's purpose and worth to each and every life.-Ronald Reagan

though I have a soft spot for Rocket and Andy, but I'd give that one a 5, Neil.

I'm just thankful he went quickly. If he's broken any laws, I hope he's brought up on charges. Who knows how long he's been using the power of his position for his own sick fantasies.

Ultimately, if it is true that this man was a child predator (as opposed to just being gay) then it is an unqualified good thing that he is out of Congress and maybe going to jail. Party issues aside, that is an unqualified good thing.

A precedent embalms a principle.
- Disraeli

To clarify my original point, I wasn't saying it was a bad day because Foley was resigning, I was saying it was a bad day because a seemingly respectable GOP congressman is resigning a seemingly safe GOP seat in utter disgrace.

Right. Bad that this sort of thing happened, good that a real dirtbag is gone.

I just read the transcript of the instant messaging (which I assume is genuine or he wouldn't have resigned so fast)....

he's going to jail.

A 50+ year old man talking like this to a kid who isn't even 18?

The irony if he goes to jail based on laws he helped pass will be rich, and he deserves whatever he gets.

Nothing better than someone who has been a total hypocrite being hoisted on his own petard--in this case, a pedophile.


Well that's a great comment on a day like this, nothing about the failings of this man, which appear to be many, but instead warp it into a commentary on party purity and purge of what you consider RINOS. Way to go!

Before you go down that road, remember that it takes the help of those very RINOS and those of us not in the Social Conservative wing of the Republican party to effectively legislate. On top of which, if the Democrats gain a majority in ether house, those you demean to today may be the very help you seek tomorrow.

Another South Park Republican spouting off

Retaining power would not justify holding on to scum like this.

And some would argue that the current crop of Republicans that have prostrated themselves before the alter of "What ever it takes to stay in power" would also be well served by a trip to the wilderness.

"We Suck Less" is not a standard that I can rally to.

Another South Park Republican spouting off !

Be able to find a replacement? What's the law?
Sitting out is a vote for KOS.

Great lady. Our best chance to hold the seat. NRCC will swoop in with the dough. Our odds are slightly better than average.

It was either going to be Gayle or Joe. I guessed wrong above. Personally, I think she would have been a better pick for a range of reasons. But Joe Negron is a solid conservative, well known in the district, and will make us proud. We certainly could have done worse.

He has respectable cash on hand from his almost-run for attorney general. That will keep the NRCC from having to dump too much into the race when they are already stretched thin. But it will still require a substantial federal/state partnership to get Negron over the line. We can do it.

-"I will refrain from pointing out that Barney Frank is still in Congress..."

Well yeah, but Barney Frank was never accused of being a pedophile, was he?

"...and I will refrain from daring to suggest that this is just another example of why the policy against gay scoutmasters in the Boy Scouts is a good one."

I agree 100%.

But Gerry Studds had an affair with a male page & zip happened.

If "pro" is the opposite of "con", what is the opposite of "progress"?

...I think that this is one time when we're better off not commenting about the faults of the Other Side.

I mean. The blipping chairman of the House Caucus on Missing and Exploited Children. Ghandi couldn't resist taking a swing at that if it came across the plate.

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

Just making a point for the sake of historical accuracy. And for the record Franks/Studds have nothing to do with the current situation.

Foley just needs to go away quitely.

If "pro" is the opposite of "con", what is the opposite of "progress"?

That's a "subject matter expert."

What a sicko, and I am embarrassed that he called himself a Republican.

Republican in name only. He is a media darling because of it. Media & Democrats simply hope to get 1 seat closer so they threw their safe RINO ally under the bus.

They still will not gain the Senate nor the House. Rep Goode of VA switched last from Dem to Taylor of MS or others do the same before Dems elect speaker Pelosi by 1 or 2 votes.

Democrats will swing & miss again anyway. Bush & GOP always counted out last 3 cycles then the media recriminations begin...Bush in 2000, Senate in 2002, Presidential in 2004, House in 2006...they will just miss again. Could you not tell the media thought Kerry won weeks before election & all the way til 10PM EST election day?

Election day & aftermath is the fun part that makes tolerable now this psyche game the media wing of the Democrat party play.

Are you suggesting that the correct thing would have been to suppress the story? I really can't wrap my head around your post.


they'd be celebrating his "diversity" and defending his "choices." Since he's an R, he goes. I think he should go, don't get me wrong, but don't delude yourself about what the Ds would be saying were he one of theirs.

In Vino Veritas

but then you never know, but in general I think people will write off "over age" stuff, and if it was somebody over 18 diversity might be celebrated, but I am not convinced the majority of dems would seek to defend this with underage boys or girls.

I can always be proven wrong, but I think the diversity card won't go too far given the age of the pages.

I don't care what party like that scumbag is in - if it meant losing control of the House I would still say he should resign immediately and if he doesn't, both parties should vote him out immediately.

To quote shakesphere (from memory) - what good does it do a man to gain the world while losing his soul.

The pages are our children entrusted to the Congress.

an intern?

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

in this context and why he should resign. Your party has no history of resignations for aberrant behavior in the area of its just sex: Barney Frank, et al

What exactly, based on liberal democrat "values" is wrong with e-mail sex talk between consenting to read sexual verbiage adults? Which, especially given that fellatio is not sex according to the sexologist in chief and his party, sans Lieberman, in 1998.

This story shows the difference between the parties. Bad behavior has consequences in the GOP, even if no law is broken and its "only about sex."

The age of consent for sex is age 16 in many states. But, this was an obvious moral transgression, unaccompanied by sworn statements in a civil suit. Unaccompanied by obstruction in enlisting others to lie. Unaccompanied by contempt of court fines for perjury.

Yet, a GOP congressman resigns 6 weeks before an election.

The GOP has moral standards.
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

I thought both Frank & Clinton should have been censured.

The difference here is that this was with a High School student working as a page where Congress is acting as their gaurdian in fact if not legally.

This was a person in a position of trust preying on a child. And it clearly was not concensual.

Frank & Clinton was a consenual relationship with an adult. Although Clinton was arguably into the grey area also of having a position of authority over Monica.

Consent to e-mails vs consent to BJ's. In many states the age of consent to INTERCOURSE is 16. This is about e-mails, and so is much less damning than Frank's illegal activity in running a brothel and Clinton's seduction and ruination of a person.

Foley should have and did resign. His behavior was wrong. But was it illegal? I don't know, but I doubt it, and it certainly was not worse than Bill's if all that occurred was e-mail sex. But more may come out.

But given the difference between intercourse and e-mails and that the age of consent for intercourse is 16, I think the issue is a non sequitur as applies to e-mails.
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

"Frank & Clinton was a consenual relationship"

Frank and Clinton were an item? What a story! How did I miss that one.

By the way, which Clinton? Nevermind....

Re: This is about e-mails, and so is much less damning than Frank's illegal activity in running a brothel and Clinton's seduction and ruination of a person.

By all accounts Ms Lewinsky was in the seduction business herself. You don't generally snap your undies in someone's face unless it's an invite of somesort. Not that Bill needed much of an invite.
Anyway, I did think Clinton should have resigned. I am not familiarwith the Frank scandal so cannot comment. As for Foley though, cruising underage boys does strike me as a lot more serious than a roll in the hay with an overweight nympho (which actually describes both of them, now that I think of it!)
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

but if he did, he got it from an older source:

Mark 8:36 (KJV): For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?


Matthew 16:26 (KJV): For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

Retire Lindsey Graham. Support Thomas Ravenel for Senate 2008

but bumpy

I am saying Rep Foley is a known media darling because he is a Republican in Name Only...RINO. The Democrats & media used him & his quotes to hurt Republicans for years and counted on his votes for some liberal/moderate causes. They suppressed these stories then. Today they don't.

Now, they simply need the seat. So, they hit him with what they (& I) have heard about for years. I'm glad they finally came out with it. They had been protecting him for yrs cause he was one of their own kindred souls...well, a cousin once removed perhaps.

that the GOP congressional leadership was aware of Foley's amours with the pages and likewise looked the over way. If that's true (and I will take it with a grain of salt absent proof), some other folks need to have their hands slapped good and hard.

This was an offer they can't refuse.

My God. This is pathetic.

They would fail every time.
Franks was busted for sex with a teenage page and for his male prostitute-roomie running a gay prostitution ring out of Barney's apartment. The dems in charge in those days covered for him, buried both and protected him. The dems best strategy is to get us to apply standards they have no intention of ever applying to themselves.

It was Rep. Studds (what a name...) with the 17 year old page, and Rep. Frank with the prostitute roomie.
If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

Studds and Frank both like young ones.
barney also likes having his main squeeze close at hand but wants him working ahrd.
But the dems like this. It is all about power for them. Truth, honor, integrity, registered live legal voters...everyting for dems is negotiable.

You forget that Dan Crane was censured at the same time as Studds. Crane was a Republican from Illinois and was cited for inappropriate contact with an underage female page.

Being a pedophile has nothing to do with sexual orientation or party affiliation.

Oh yeah - he didn't get re-elected. Unlike Studds and Frank.

"No compromise with the main purpose, no peace till victory, no pact with unrepentant wrong." - Winston Churchill

he has been generally "disappeared" from public life. And he was a second tier Presidential contender too.

If "pro" is the opposite of "con", what is the opposite of "progress"?

He ran, and his district decided not to send him back. Studds's district did. Neither party did anything to force either of them out or keep them from running, however, so I'm not sure what your point is.

tend to be blacklisted by Republicans and welcomed with open arms by Democrats.

If "pro" is the opposite of "con", what is the opposite of "progress"?

I'm glad someone here knows what psychologists have been saying for decades: pedophilia has little, if anything, to do with orientation. It's the knee-jerk reaction, among many here, to connect pedophilia with homosexuality, and I had little hope it wouldn't happen, but it's nice to see that someone knows otherwise.

Actually, its not pedophilia unless it involves a prepubescent child. young ones.
...likes having his main squeeze close at hand but...working ahrd.

Sounds like half the men I know, without regard to sexual orientation or political persuasion.

a pedophile, but there is this:

In response to a story in the Aug. 25, 1989, Washington Times, Frank confirmed that he hired Steve Gobie, a male prostitute, in 1985 to live with and work for him in his D.C. apartment. But Frank, who is gay, said Frank campaign button he fired Gobie in 1987 when he learned he was using the apartment to run a prostitution service. The Boston Globe, among others, called on Frank to resign, but he refused. On July 19, 1990, the ethics committee recommended Frank be reprimanded because he "reflected discredit upon the House" by using his congressional office to fix 33 of Gobie's parking tickets. Attempts to expel or censure Frank failed; instead the House voted 408-18 to reprimand him.

A precedent embalms a principle.
- Disraeli

Is the House completely out of reach now? I mean, this race wasn't even on the map? How do we expect to win, when we just give away safe seats on top of the close ones we already have to battle for.

I am close to giving up. The GOP clearly got to comfortable in power, and, now, they very well may have just lost it. Gosh.

will eventually learn to stop feeling content with stuffed shirts in supposedly safe seats.

The Democrats can not take the house unless they knock off Republicans in Republican districts the incumbent (by definition) & Pres Bush won.

Our fate is firmly in our hands. Stand fast. Be worried only when the opposing team has their fate in their hands...when they can make the play that *makes* us lose. Instead, now they must not only do well in their air/ground game, they must depend upon us fumbling or not turning out to vote in GOP districts.

Needing one's opponent to screw up is not a strategy. Hope is not a method.

Democrats are destined for disappointment again. You have seen their anxiety in the face of Bush polls numbers, falling gas prices, negative ad "direct hits" on their liberal challengers, yes? Hear about their targeting of new GOP Rep Thelma Drake in VA? She's safe now...Democrat challenger was arrested & plead guilty to assaulting a woman. Splash one more off their radar screen.

So what if we lost a RINO today? We may replace him w/ a conservative--that's what we do at RedState. Convert or defeat RINOs & Democrats.

The scandals are not entirely asymmetric. Democratic representative william jefferson (the guy with the 100k bribe stuffed in his freezer) is such an example. Although he has not resigned, he might as well, as he is up for re-election.

which means his replacement (assuming the dumb people in the Big Easy don't reelect him) will be a Democrat anyway.

A precedent embalms a principle.
- Disraeli

why play games like you won't?

That seems rather small.

It is also "clever" how you turn allegations against a member of the GOP into an attack against Frank. I am no great fan of Frank, but what on earth does he have to do with these specific alleged actions done by Rep. Foley?

My thoughts go out to Rep Foley's family, and to the page (s) who allegedly got these emails.

misconstrues and examination of history with an attack. Sort of like clinton needing to lash out against a question, lie in his answer, and still be hailed a great leader. avoid responsibility and accountability, for oneself or one's tribe:

"He did it too!"
"He did it first!"
"He did it worse!"

"They did it too!"
"They did it first!"
"They did it worse!"

Also the "I deny thee" response: "He wasn't really one of us in the first place."

I believe the law in Florida is that the GOP can name a replacement, but Foley's name has to stay on the ballot and all votes for Foley go to the replacement.

So for the GOP to win, people have to vote for Foley (at least in name).

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that's the case.


Title IX

Chapter 100

100.111 Filling vacancy

(4)(a) In the event that death, resignation, withdrawal, removal, or any other cause or event should cause a party to have a vacancy in nomination which leaves no candidate for an office from such party, the Department of State shall notify the chair of the appropriate state, district, or county political party executive committee of such party; and, within 5 days, the chair shall call a meeting of his or her executive committee to consider designation of a nominee to fill the vacancy. The name of any person so designated shall be submitted to the Department of State within 7 days after notice to the chair in order that the person designated may have his or her name on the ballot of the ensuing general election. If the name of the new nominee is submitted after the certification of results of the preceding primary election, however, the ballots shall not be changed and the former party nominee's name will appear on the ballot. Any ballots cast for the former party nominee will be counted for the person designated by the political party to replace the former party nominee. If there is no opposition to the party nominee, the person designated by the political party to replace the former party nominee will be elected to office at the general election. For purposes of this paragraph, the term "district political party executive committee" means the members of the state executive committee of a political party from those counties comprising the area involving a district office.


"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan

about those cheap shots but they have been removed. Bravo for the big tent...

It seems like the Republicans do not do through character checks on people who run for office under their banner.

Crystal clear histories should be a requirement to get the party's support if we are going to be a values party. There are enough decent, clean living people who can stand for office and win, but the GOP does not seem to enforce its values on its own members.

Look at Bush campaigning for Sherwood in PA. Sherwood beat up his mistress in public. This is not rumor but fact and Bush the man who claims to full of values campaigns for him.

If we are going to be a values party, we support candidates who live up to the basic social values we are supposedly defending.

If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

Or do we really have a regular Joe Republican with this kind of alleged trouble?

If so, there are hypocrites who betray their values: and, hypocrisy is the tribute vice pays to virtue.

But, there are RINOs who play to the media & limosene set's liberal opinions. If he's one of them, let him eat cake.

Keep the eye on the real threat: for there are the openly liberal Democrats who are loyal to their church as state. Who must win to shove their liberal sacrements down our throats. For we will never kneel.

It is up to us citizens to do our own homework on the candidates we choose to vote for. That job does not belong to the party. Or to anyone else but us.

Lets see, how about that William Jeffords, D-Louisiana, he still in the House? Why? $90k not enough?

Anybody inform W-VA voters about Byrd's N*Word comments on air two years ago? That get a pass? Why because he said he was sorry. Yeah sure, grand kleagle of the KKK using the n*word and no one says anything. Talk about closet racist.

And oh boy oh Murtha, ABSCAM supremo, what's up with that.

So Allen says he didn't use the n*word, Sabato not seen again, Webb writes book full of n*words -- Why isn't Webb's fate that what was being planed for Allen.

I think there is a pattern here, just can't quite put my finger on it.

they protect their perverts and criminals. We toss them out.

I didn't see anything about anyone tossing him. Who was responsible for this bit of housekeeping?

Or at leats he asked him to leave. Saw a clip of Hastert saying Foley did the right thing.

express interest in some House leadership position and mysteriously withdraw?

Webb wrote a *fictional* book, with *characters* using the n-word. This isn't the same as a person using the word in conversation or towards real people.

Fine...Webb fantasizes about using the N-word. I don't know if that's such a good thing, either.

Best to build up some real literary credibility before making such endeavors - especially if you think you might run for office one day.

the n word is in "to kill a mockingbird." would you say harper lee fantasizes about using the n word? obviously not.

but your larger point is on target. i think webb has some skeletons in his closet about race and women.

Of course, that goes without saying.

My wife writes fiction for a living. Believe me, she does not believe or say everything her characters do.

I think driving down the street shouting racial slurs at blacks and pretending to shoot them to see them run, might validate the feelings in a fictional book, don't you think.

Writing a book as vile as his, fiction or not, indicates a problem, Webb needs to pull out of the race if you ask me.

Do not represent such a break from social norms as what Foley has done. People almost expect corruption from politicians and it isn't as much of a headline when it is uncovered. Even with Clinton, people were able to sympathize and understand how his "incident" happened. How many people out there are going to be understanding and willing to look the other way regarding what Foley did? Not very many, and even less who would admit it if they were.

These are the actions of a man, not the party. To make that connection is unequivocally specious.

Leave that dishonest game to the other side. I give it about 4 hours before they make this a "party" issue.

Senator Foley did the right thing by first apologizing and second resigning. When have we seen that type of behavior from the other side, especially in the midst of an election? Never. Accordingly, that action, the character which makes a person realize ignominious action, seek forgiveness and pursue atonement is what makes us different. We take responsibility for our actions and suffer the consequences irrespective of penalty. That’s called honest and candid assessment. Let the first man who is perfect amongst us stand up and oppose those rightful actions.

"Dulce et decorum est pro patria mori"

If "pro" is the opposite of "con", what is the opposite of "progress"?

I found a news story that linked to the emails. He're the stuff that caused his resignation:

The problem I have is this appears to be heavily edited extracts from one side of the emails. I'd rather see the whole emails in context instead of these partial sentance extracts.

This guy may have been set up.

...(link here) that "Hours earlier, ABC News had read excerpts of instant messages provided by former male pages who said the congressman, under the AOL Instant Messenger screen name Maf54, made repeated references to sexual organs and acts."

So if it ain't true, then ABC is going to end up getting sued all the way down to lowercase status...

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

some there there, I also would like to see everything in context-the full text of the emails and the full IM conversations.

But even if the context of both indicates that the pages were begging him to have sex with them, he is the adult, they are the minors and he has the responsibility to say "no."

I just think the information in context would be nice to see, and small excerpts could give the wrong impression-but given the fact that he doesn't appear to be denying it, and he did resign, I suspect the emails and IM's in full context are more than enough to support wrong doing.

I disagreed with the demotion of Lott for birthday party exaggerations. But, when it comes to the power relationship between elected officials and interns (who, by definition, are above the age of consent) I support a standard that does not require stained dresses, perjury, obstruction of justice, contempt fines, definitions of sex and is, and statements that impeachment battle was badge of honor!!

And even Foley hasn't wagged a finger, noted a smirk, detected a right wing conspiracy, lied about the 90s in nearly every sentence or poked a reporter's knee.
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

You have to hand it to the media, they kept this back for the optimum moment. Had they run with it six months ago it would have much less impact.

A safe GOP seat could have gotten a new candidate by name on the ballot. ABC has probably been telling the Dems they've got this seat locked up for them for months.

I'd like to know how long ABC has been sitting on this and how long they've had these text messages.

So according to the St. Petersburg Times, the paper has sat on this story for almost a year. Possible political motives aside, they could have put quite a few more kids in danger of this guy's advances. Is it just me, or does this smack of journalistic irresponsibility?

Like the NYT, make sure that releasing bad news on Republicans happens at the best time for dems. Then make sure that bad news on dems comes out at the best time for dems - never.

. . . late on a Friday afternoon is never the best time to release anything.

The orignal SP Times story ran yesterday, but my point was that had this been published, say, last November, a none of the pages selected for 2006 never would have been exposed to his behavior. I am in no way blaming the paper for his actions, but it could have helped put an end to them much earlier.

that it would not have been as useful for the Democrats hopes of taking the House.

up for the Sunday talk shows.

In Vino Veritas

He should have bowed out a long time ago if this was the case.

"Took the nickname Troll long before BlogTrolls existed..."

...So did the House Leadership.
The page worked for Rep. Rodney Alexander, R-La., who said Friday that when he learned of the e-mail exchanges 10 to 11 months ago, he called the teen's parents. Alexander told the Ruston Daily Leader, "We also notified the House leadership that there might be a potential problem," a reference to the House's Republican leaders.

Full Article

It might actually not be the media's fault this time.

Keep telling yourself that, as the media does its usual hatchet job, painting the GOP as the party of pedophiles over the next few weeks. By Monday, "notified the House leadership that there might be a potential problem" will have become, "Did their best to cover it up."

Look, if the House leadership really believed that Foley was doing something inappropriate, he would have been forced to quietly resign and get help. I think we can agree that there's simply no way Hastert would have let him stay in office, much less co-chair the Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus, which would have been (and now is) a PR disaster waiting to happen. Obviously, that didn't occur, ergo, the leadership could not have had any clue as to what was going on.

There's an excellent chance that this is going to cost us the House. You can bet the MSM is going to do its best to make sure that happens.

This is Foley's fault and his alone. The media did not make him send inappropriate email and disgusting IM traffic to children.

And if you believe that leadership would not cover this up, look no further than the Catholic Church for an example of people you trust abusing that trust to cover themselves. Leadership knew and kept him on.

or just rumors? If the latter then they were right not to publish (though they should have passed the iumors on to the relevant authorities for investigation). Even if rumorst urn out to be true I don't think the media should wun them publicly without hard evidence. That risks libel charges, as well racheting up the politics of scandal strategy which is already too much in vogue.

is how many more October surprises does the media have lined up waiting to go.

a congressmen makes sexual advances on a minor and you want to blame the newspapers. great.

we should all condemn foley and move along.

Kathleen Harris.. drops out to run into this seat.
Jeb Bush.. runs for KH's seat.

'everyone' is happy? (except Jeb and Kathleen)... can this even happen?

"Took the nickname Troll long before BlogTrolls existed..."

First of all, it's Katharine Harris, not Kathleen.

That would be the ideal scenario, but...Mark Foley's situation doesn't change the fact that Jeb Bush obviously didn't want to run for the Senate. Dubya couldn't even recruit his own brother for the sake of the party...I don't know why this would change his mind.

Only if Katherine Harris became convinced that she couldn't win the Senate seat would she dropout to run for this one. Even though everyone else seems to be convinced that Katherine can't win, she doesn't at all seem to be. She has said all along, however, that she would drop out only for Jeb Bush.

I think that Tom Gallagher should run for Mark Foley's seat.

had it as K. Harris and wasn't sure when I went full... bad me

however its with an A not an E so I get to fling a small parcel of mud back at you.. bad you (har)

"Took the nickname Troll long before BlogTrolls existed..."

...I realized that after I typed it. I got it correct later in the post, but flubbed it the first mention or two.

He's made it pretty clear he has no interest in going to Washington.

The replacement candidate will likely come from within the ranks of the Florida Senate or the Florida House. And it will be someone who has a good relationship with Governor Bush, who surely will be called upon to rally the troops behind whomever is chosen to be the designee for those who vote for Foley.

Bank on it.

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism. -Theodore Roosevelt

it will be someone whose name is easy to spell for the write-in, unlike Texas.

Does he live in this district? He was running for AG before dropping out and had raised some decent money. Boy, if that money was transferable (anyone out there know if that would be the case in FLA?), he could maybe, possibly win the seat. Still probably not, but he'd be much better than nothing.

That's the guy I was thinking of, but I couldn't find where I read that. Thanks.

It's a GOP district and if Negron was big enough to even run for Attorney General, then he obviously should have more clout than the puny Democrat in the race.

Remains on the ballot, I think. So people would have to vote for him to vote for Negron, which will be a hard sell. Plus, Bush only got 54% of the vote there and this year is tougher than 04. That being said, Mahoney's a sleazeball, and it'd be nice to give the district a decent choice.

But it will divert precious resources to hold.

Polls had Mahoney closing in on Foley before this all happened. Negron would have a heck of a time holding the seat. I'm not saying he can't do it, but I think it would immediately become one of the top five most likely to change hands, with AZ-8, IA-1, CO-7, and TX-22.

Jim Negron does live in the district. Also his State Senate district almost matches the 16th Congressional district so he is known by the voters. However because of state law, Jeb Bush gets to decide who the Republican nominee will be. Also, Mark Foley's name stays on the ballot.

Several places are reporting that his name can be replaced on the ballot. See Human Events Online for one.

that the replacement will likely be the guy who dropped out of the Republican Attorney General primary against Bill McCollum.

Is if what Troll says would happen.

Otherwise, I'm afraid, it revives the GOP as being the party of corruption and strengthens the anti-incumbant mood.

Skip the K. Harris plan.

Just go with the Jeb plan. It's just two years anyway.. not as bad as the 6 for senator. Jeb might go for it.

Bonus would be with him on the ticket he could drag a few more R's accross the finish line in FL (ie Harris, etc.). His name on the Ballot would be great for the GOTV effort.

Can that happen?

"Took the nickname Troll long before BlogTrolls existed..."

but does Jeb Bush live in the district Foley represented?

A precedent embalms a principle.
- Disraeli

Doesn't matter, so long as you live in the state. And Jeb could obviously speak to the issues important to the district as he has been its governor for eight years.

Mahoney's from New Jersey, and moved to the district after going there to buy a piece of art. I'm not sure Jeb would be easily tagged with the carpetbagger label if he moved in for a few years to bail his party out on this one.

Ann Coulter does live in Foley's district. I wonder if anybody has talked with her about running for the seat. If she ran then that might put a frown on some of those smiling dem pundits.

You’re a persistent cuss, pilgrim.
John Wayne to Jimmy Stewart in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance

But I don't think that the GOP bigwigs care that much for Ann, and thus would probably not make her their first choice.

The upside, though: she'd be a self-funding candidate. :-)

Even if the seat was lost, Ann running would be worth it, just for the entertainment value.

Another South Park Republican spouting off

If she runs and wins can you imagine the entertainment value of Ann Coulter engagin Sheila Jackson Lee in a floor debate?

You’re a persistent cuss, pilgrim.
John Wayne to Jimmy Stewart in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance

A party candidate isn't going to change the dynamic at this point. But maybe Coulter could win a conservative district against a carpet bagger. Getting a campaign message out wouldn't be a problem.

He could have just switched parties and stayed in.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

If "pro" is the opposite of "con", what is the opposite of "progress"?

This story shows the difference between the parties. Bad behavior has consequences in the GOP, even if no law is broken and its "only about sex."

The age of consent for sex is age 16 in many states. But, this was an obvious moral transgression, unaccompanied by sworn statements in a civil suit. Unaccompanied by obstruction in enlisting others to lie. Unaccompanied by contmpt of court fines for perjury.

Yet, a GOP congressman resigns 6 weeks before an election.

The GOP has moral standards.
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

While I know that none of us our happy about the jeopardy that this seat is now in, I think we should all be happy that we're going to be rid of this guy.

How can we call ourselves the party of family values if we don't ditch our scum? Let's do the right thing and get rid of the sleazos like Abramoff, Cunningham, Kolbe and Foley.

If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

Not to stir up trouble here. And I know he's not on anyone's allstar list since he hasn't exactly made electing Graf his top priority. But just because he's gay, is that why he is a sleazo?

I'd like to hope that there's room in the party for a strong economic conservative who happens to be gay. His op-ed about the Doha round of free trade in the WaPo a few weeks (months?) back was quite strong.

He certainly hasn't done anything bad enough to deserve being on a list with Abramoff, Cunningham and Foley, has he?

Kolbe isn't a stellar Republican, but I think that he's at least as good or better than another famous Republican from that state, John McCain, on more issues than he is worse than McCain on.

To lump him in with Foley is dispicable.

What makes Kolbe "scum"?

Gee, guys, I don't know how to break it to you but there are still people out there who think gay is wrong. I've always been embarrassed that the GOP shielded a gay Congressman in Arizona. I offer no apologies for it and I'm really glad he'll be gone. If you don't like it, well, then maybe you need to remember that there are lots of Republicans who just don't like gays.

then maybe you need to remember that there are lots of Republicans who just don't like gays.
Cause streiff threatened to ban me once for claiming this. Maybe you're just speaking in haste, though.

Your personal intolerance is far removed from representing the GOP as a whole. Foley didn't resign because of his sexual orientation. Frankly the GOP could use more openly gay members, if for no other reason than to help negate the stereotype of an intolerant party. Your individual feelings are your own, but they certainly don't contribute anything to winning elections.

Would you really not support a gay politician who is anti-spending, anti-big government, anti-abortion, and who strongly supports the president on national security issues? Not that a particular politician who fits that profile comes to mind, of course, but I certainly know voters who fit that profile but who vote Democratic because of the Republican Party's historical hostility toward gays.

I understand that this attitude is prevalent in many places but I would suggest that there are many more imortant issues out there.

it just drives more politicians into the closet and makes embarrassing situations like this more commonplace. Then again, the duplicity needed to stay closeted at 40 or 50 years old is an asset for, not a hindrance to, a career in politics.

Your personal intolerance is far removed from representing the GOP as a whole.

So Steve....would you be in support of the return of the ever popular Pink Triangle as a part of your "just don't like", program?

Another South Park Republican spouting off !

who think that drinking is wrong, or that atheism is wrong. Should we start demanding 100% obedience by all candidates to all conceivable sectarian canons and fatwas?
By the way, the GOP has not "protected" Kolbe. He hasn't done anything illegal to be protected from. The voters of his district have returned him to office repeatedly because they like the job he's done and could not care less about the details of his private life. Your beef is really with these voters, but telling voters they are immoral nitwits for not following your own preferrences in such matters is not a winning strategy, as the Democrats have still failed to learn.

to try and fashion legislation that protects individual rights fwithout regard to sexual orientation but that meets the need they seek to fulfill rather than group rights. Now, from a moral standpoint, I do not favor public advertisement of sex outside marriage, but I deal with the world as it is, and I love all people, and have found that I get along well with gay people and have always had gay friends. i do think it was better when they didn't advertise their private behavior though.
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

Re: i do think it was better when they didn't advertise their private behavior though.

That, sadly, is the spirit of our age. Exhibitionism (and not just in the sexual sense) is now the besetting sin of early 21st century America.

Second, why would you even bother?

Kolbe is a jackass, a condition unrelated to his sexual preferences. Move along.

Even those who learn from history are surrounded by those doomed to repeat it.

...we do not in fact permit the equation of 'mere' homosexuality with (respectively) corruption, sedition and ephebophilia to pass unchallenged. Do not do that again.

Thank you in advance for your compliance in this matter.


The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

I have been away and came back to this thread and found some of you guys' responses are almost humorously uninformed. Your implications that my aversions for homosexuality are not in any way representative of the GOP are borderline fatuous.

Let me offer a little bit of data to some of you conservatives in denial of reality: A recent Gallup Poll found that a majority of Americans (and an overwhelming majority of Republicans) regarded homosexuality morally wrong. Hmmm. I wonder if that means that they're, um, you know 'intolerant' of gays? Gee, maybe they wouldn't feel comfortable having a homosexual represent their district in Congress? Don't forget that, even in liberal California where I vote, at least 1 our of 3 of the population feel so stronly about it that they even wished homosexual relations were still illegal. The fact taht Republican politicians oppose gay rights/marriage is a major reason for their success in places like the South, Midwest, etc. Don't you guys think you're a little hasty in suggesting the GOP is pro-gay? Hello?

Oh, and in response to a post made earlier by someone wondering if I had a problem with voting for a gay politician, yes I would have a real problem with that, just like I would in voting for an adulterer.

It's actually kind of pitiful reading 'conservatives' trying to deny the simple and fundamental reality that there are millions of Americans and Republicans who just aren't comfortable with homosexuality.

As I mentioned previously, I won't be replying on this thread on this matter anymore, as my point simply stands. I understand that some of you disagree with me on this, but, honestly, I really don't care.

Thanks for proving the point steve11. Too many alleged right-wingers won't be as plain spoken in their hatred. Good work, steve. You really are a model republican.

Thanks for proving the point liberalrising. Too many alleged left-wingers won't be as plain spoken in their hatred. Good work, lib. You really are a model democrat.

"Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty"

I offered steve11 praise. You saw hatred. Hmm. Interesting mindset.

Republicans hate gays who hate Republicans because they believe Liberals who tell them that Republicans hate gays.

I'm a Republican, and I don't hate gays, now or in the pas...w ell, scratch that, there have been a few gays that I've hated -- but not because they were gay, really. Because they were jerks. They were jerks, who in the process of wrecking their lives were making mine almost intolerable. And I can tell you that yes, that does indeed inspire hateful emotions. But I didn't hate those gays when I was a Republican -- I hated them when I was a Leftist/Liberal!

In fact, in the fullness of time, I came to realize that a few of those people actually hated themselves and it had nothing to do with Republicans, or Democrats, or the price of tea in China. It had to do with the fact that they had chosen to live their lives in such a way that was extraordinarily self-destructive, and that was what had made them miserable. The problem is that, for some of those people, the price of correcting their self-destructive ways was exorbitant, not just to themselves, but everyone around them. It wears you out. It exhausts even the most humane individual, Republican or Democrat.

Aww man. Just as I started digging steve11's plain-spoken hatred, here you come to ruin the mood with obfuscation and politcal speak. You just used more words that you needed to to say that you don't hate gays, but you just think of them as less-than-you.

I liked steve11's way of saying it better.

Reading what I wrote, I can't help you. I don't think of gays as "less than me." And I never have said anything of the kind. But I have known quite a few very badly-behaving gay people and I've expended no small amount of time and energy and money trying to help a few of them in the past -- because I cared about them, and because I was a friend. If you can't understand the distinction, you have no business posting any further in this thread.

Not approving is now 'hating'?
What a mindless twit argument you make.

Alright, you've had your fun. Now go away.


The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.


The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

"but I would suggest that there are many more imortant issues out there."

and yes, I suggest this to my aforementioned conservative gay friends, as well.

Thanks for speaking your mind, steve. Its good to see a republican saying what he really thinks for once.

"It is a sordid business, this divvying us up by race." - Chief Justice John Roberts

If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots.


There's not much else you can say.

"Who will stand/On either hand/And guard this bridge with me?" (Macaulay)

"To discuss evil in a manner implying neutrality, is to sanction it." AR

"Who will stand/On either hand/And guard this bridge with me?" (Macaulay)


"Who will stand/On either hand/And guard this bridge with me?" (Macaulay)

there's a guy who believed in the real thing, no e mails for him. Studds turned out to be something of a hero, but then he's a democrat from Massachusetts where they may have different feelings about sex with pages. Things and events do get turned on their heads when parties are switched.

"a man's admiration for absolute government is proportinate to the contempt he feels for those around him". Tocqueville

AP reports that the page's sponsor, Rep. Rodney Alexander (R-LA), learned about this in late 2005 and notified Rep. Thomas Reynolds (R-NY).

The story also says the House Page Board was notified, but it's unclear if any action was taken.

I did some research and found out who's on the House Page Board:

Chairman: Rep. John Shimkus (R-IL)
Members: Rep. Shelley Moore Capito (R-WV), Rep. Dale Kildee (D-MI), House Clerk Karen L. Haas and Sergeant at Arms Bill Livingood.

If my 16-year-old kid was a page, I'd want to know about this so I could ask him if *he'd* been approached inappropriately. If true, this is criminal behavior that has nothing to do with politics.

All the way up here.

Come on. This may be a freebee for the Democrats, but it doesn't mean that you can be sloppy. Read the whole thread next time.

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

This wouldn't even *be* a political football if they'd just told the Democrat on the House Page Board about this last year.

Here's Shimkus' statement:

“As chairman of the bipartisan House Page Board in late 2005, I was notified by the then Clerk of the House, who manages the Page Program, that he had been told by Congressman Rodney Alexander about an email exchange between Congressman Foley and a former House Page. I took immediate action to investigate the matter.

“In that email exchange, Congressman Foley asked about the former Page’s well-being after Hurricane Katrina and requested a photograph. When asked about the email exchange, Congressman Foley said he expressed concern about the Page’s well-being and wanted a photo to see that the former Page was alright.<[> “Congressman Foley told the Clerk and me that he was simply acting as a mentor to this former House Page and that nothing inappropriate had occurred. Nevertheless, we ordered Congressman Foley to cease all contact with this former House Page to avoid even the appearance of impropriety. We also advised him to be especially mindful of his conduct with respect to current and former House Pages, and he assured us he would do so. I received no subsequent complaints about his behavior nor was I ever made aware of any additional emails.

“It has become clear to me today, based on information I only now have learned, that Congressman Foley was not honest about his conduct.

“As Chairman of the House Page Board, I am working with the Clerk to fully review this incident and determine what actions need to be taken.

“The House Page Program has been an integral part of the House of Representatives for many decades. Preserving the integrity of the House Page Program is of utmost importance to me and to the House of Representatives, and we intend to uphold and protect its values and traditions.”

Your personal intolerance is far removed from representing the GOP as a whole.>>

I agree. This would have been a good way for the GOP to demonstrate the size of their big tent by embracing the kinky Mark Foley into their flock.

The alleged homosexuality is not the issue.

The GOP tent isn't big enough for a member of Congress over 50 years old who has any kind of inappropriate relationship with a minor child under 18. It is wholly appropriate to send Foley back to private life where hopefully he can get his moral compass back.(I suppose if Foley wants his seat back he'll have to switch to the Dems. They seem to welcome people who behave inappropriately.)

The gender of the page is not the issue. The age and position as page are.

Retire Lindsey Graham. Support Thomas Ravenel for Senate 2008


Even those who learn from history are surrounded by those doomed to repeat it.

here's a guy who headed a children's caucus and screwing around on the side with kids, literally.

THANK GOD this creep is gone. This issue is personal with me because I was a congressional page once and he used his power to take advantage of a young and impressionable kid.

I'm a conservative and all, but this is just one more reason the republican MUST be voted out of office this november, i'm sorry, this is just plain sick.

I'd rather see Speaker Pelosi than keep Denny Haster asleep at the wheel while all this is going on.

Further proof that Hastert has absolutely zero control over his crew in the house.

Why don't we just change the rules and have everyone working for or with a member of congress be at least 21 years old!

They we NEVER have to worry about this kinda crap ever again.

"Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty"

I'd rather we not deprive many of the chance at these internships because of a small few.
If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

why? by kyle8

Seems to me this is an anachronism. In every other part of modern life you are expected to gain some education and maturity before you take on any important jobs. Let them learn about government in civics class.

"Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty"

Internships ARE a form of education, and in many ways probably better than you get from overpaid, overpoliticized universities.
If you're seeing shades of gray, it's because you're not looking close enough to see the black and white dots.

Don't throw the proverbial baby out with the bathwater. Kids are going to be in the company of adults in many places, and you can't lock them all up in safe places until they reach age 18 or 21. It's sad that the world seems to have changed so much since when I was a kid, but opportunities like serving as a page are too valuable to eliminate because of these incidents. We just have to be more vigilant about where these abusive situations can happen, etc.

One way is to supervise internet use. Not sure what the current supervision rules are for Pages, but more supervision of who they contact doesn't seem out of line, after all most parents would do such supervision of their 16/17 year olds in their homes.

of Republicans who have had to resign due to sex related scandals. Barney Frank on the other hand had a male brothel running out of his house, the previously mentined Garry Studds continued to serve and last but not least Bill Clinton, who has taken to poking other men on the lap, not only had sex with an intern but reduced the issue to the level of nothing more than poor table manners.

At least for the democrats. The media continues to treat morals as something as disposable as kleenex, and we continue to view that which is not there, liberal bias.

"a man's admiration for absolute government is proportinate to the contempt he feels for those around him". Tocqueville

Polipundit and Human Events Online are saying that Foleys name can be replaced on the ballot. Don't know if its true, just passing it on.

The logic behind their argument leaves a very narrow window of opportunity for the Florida GOP to petition Gov. Bush to call for a special primary election.

Polipundit contends:

"The Republican Party can fix this mess and get Foley off the ballot. Governor Bush can call for a “special primary election” no later than October 24, 2006. That should then allow for the removal of Foleys name!!!"

The argument seems to rely on this section of Florida election law:

(3) Whenever there is a vacancy for which a special election is required pursuant to s. 100.101, the Governor, after consultation with the Secretary of State, shall fix the dates of a special primary election and a special election. Nominees of political parties other than minor political parties shall be chosen under the primary laws of this state in the special primary election to become candidates in the special election. Prior to setting the special election dates, the Governor shall consider any upcoming elections in the jurisdiction where the special election will be held. The dates fixed by the Governor shall be specific days certain and shall not be established by the happening of a condition or stated in the alternative. The dates fixed shall provide a minimum of 2 weeks between each election. In the event a vacancy occurs in the office of state senator or member of the House of Representatives when the Legislature is in regular legislative session, the minimum times prescribed by this subsection may be waived upon concurrence of the Governor, the Speaker of the House of Representatives, and the President of the Senate. If a vacancy occurs in the office of state senator and no session of the Legislature is scheduled to be held prior to the next general election, the Governor may fix the dates for the special primary election and for the special election to coincide with the dates of the primary election and general election. If a vacancy in office occurs in any district in the state Senate or House of Representatives or in any congressional district, and no session of the Legislature, or session of Congress if the vacancy is in a congressional district, is scheduled to be held during the unexpired portion of the term, the Governor is not required to call a special election to fill such vacancy.

(a) The dates for candidates to qualify in such special election or special primary election shall be fixed by the Department of State, and candidates shall qualify not later than noon of the last day so fixed. The dates fixed for qualifying shall allow a minimum of 14 days between the last day of qualifying and the special primary election.

(emphasis added)

By my calculations, the Florida GOP has less than ten days to convince Gov. Bush that calling for a special primary election is in the State's best interest.

Will the Florida GOP put Gov. Bush in that unenviable position in this volatile political climate?

If so, does Gov. Bush have the political courage to act and call for a special primary election in Foley's district?


"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan

As I read the situation, it would take more political courage for Jeb *not* to call for a special election.


Why do you feel that Jeb Bush would be taking some sort of political risk in calling for a special primary to replace a man who has resigned?

Even if there were some risk, its not like he is running for re-election himself.

There's a certain degree of political courage required. One of the last administrative acts of his term as governor would be to make it possible for the Florida republicans to remove Foley's name from the ballot. This seat is already being hyped by the partisan media as the one that may tip the scale in favor of the democrats in their noble quest to take back the House from those dastardly republicans. And, his last name is Bush!

I think he may actually gain enormous political capital, but I'm almost positive he can't believe this is how he would be forced to spend the remainder of his administration.

With the majority perceived as being in the balance, there's absolutely no doubt this will be exploited from every angle.


"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan

Hasn't a vacency occurred in the HofR? If so, doesn't case (4) of 100.101?

-exits (who could definitely be wrong here)

Initially thought it said "Florida House of Representatives". I take it back.

and as Polipundit contends, the special election is needed to remove Foley's name from the ballot because of the requirements stated in 4(a), re: resignation after the primary has been duly certified.

The Florida GOP can replace Foley without a special election. They just can't remove his name from the ballot without one.


"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so." - Ronald Reagan

Okay, this new "the leadership knew and was covering it up" argument seems to be making the rounds.

The only real link I have seen is the one where they explain a reporter told the congressional sponsor who told Hastert who talked to Foley, parents didn't want to see investigation, Foley told to stop quote-and yes that is a really vague synopsis.

My questions-

There are the emails, that for the most part were weird, but not really sexually explicit.

There are the IMs which are extremely sexually explicit and creepy and makes me want to go take a shower. Which leads to question 1.

1. Did the leadership know of just the emails, or the emails and the IM's?

Because the emails don't seem to have that much in them, unless there are others we haven't seen, that make me think sexual predator. If that is all they had, Foley had his somewhat believable explaination and wasn't fessing up to the IM's, and the parents say "no thanks" I am not sure they were covering up anything, because there wasn't that much of a smoking gun if the emails are it.

If they had the IM's and the emails, I wonder just how far off the "they covered it up" charge is from the truth. Because honestly, I can't see keeping anyone around, if they had knowledge of and read the IM conversations.

2. Are there any allegations that he was actually having sex with these pages, or was he just playing IM creepy sex talk with them? If it was only the creepy sex talk, what criminal code was violated, and what state would prosecution occur in?

Not that the creepy sex talk is acceptable or defensible, but I do think it is a different action than actually having sex with them in addition to the creepy sex talk.

3. I thought I saw somewhere that other pages had provided information that Foley had IM'd them too. Is this the case?

I was talking to a friend who is a liberal Democrat, and he was going on about how the leadership knew. To me, I'd imagine if Hastert et al. knew about the im conversations on top of the emails, there's no way they would have chosen to keep it quiet for fear it would break when it's (potentially) too late to salvage the seat.

That's on top of the obvious moral implications of letting Foley keep a position of power when that was clearly the wrong thing to do.

I really hope they only knew about the emails, which in and of themselves were odd but not gross and awful like the im conversations. If they knew about both, it speaks very poorly of their moral and political judgment to keep this thing quiet.

Re; To me, I'd imagine if Hastert et al. knew about the im conversations on top of the emails, there's no way they would have chosen to keep it quiet for fear it would break when it's (potentially) too late to salvage the seat.

When people engage in cover-ups they imagine they will succeed in suppressing bad news. Do you think Cardinal Law and others imagined the Roman catholic Church would take such severe damage by their cover-ups of priestly misbehavior?

ABC is reporting that Con. Reynolds told Hastert about this after prompting from LA Rep Congressman almost six months ago! I find it implausible that the leadership did not know about this, and I don't think this is the first time he did something.

As a Catholic who has lived through the horror of Cardinal Law's reckless behavior, I am afraid we are about to be rocked by the same kind of disaster, where believers throw out the institution based on the flawed actions of human beings. It is very hard to defend the GOP to my Dem neighbors in a blue state when they see the leadership covering up pedophilia.

I think our ministers and family values advocates have to call the leadership to account or they will lose their credibility, too, just as the Roman Catholic Church lost its. It's always the cover up that kills the institution, not the actions of a deviant individual.

If we lose this election, so be it. But we lose our credibility to speak on a host of issues forever, if we allow actions that go to the core of our values to go unpunished.
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

And you ought to try to learn them before you write them down. There are no allegations of pedophilia here.

As for the alleged "cover up"- is everyone here getting their news from Democratic Underpants?

Here is a news article from a reputable source. No "cover up" is in sight.

The Speaker’s staff, Boehner and his staff and Shimkus all maintain that they knew nothing about a later batch of instant messages between Foley and the page that were far more sexually suggestive.

No one in the Speaker's office was made aware of the sexually explicit text messages which press reports suggest had been directed to another individual until they were revealed in the press and on the Internet this week," the Speaker’s release says. "In fact, no one was ever made aware of any sexually explicit email or text messages at any time."

That is a much more detailed and sober explanation of events. Based on that, there is no cover-up in sight.

There are two things here. First, there were the emails which were not sexually suggestive, and those were investigated and dealt with.

Second, there were the IMs which were sexually explicit but were unknown to anyone in the leadership. Since they did not know about them, they did not cover-up anything.


Given that they were unaware of the IMs there doesn't seem to have been much to go on with regards to investigations or resignations-given that the emails were weird but not sexually explicit-I don't know that they had anywhere to go other than asking him to stop. Foley apparantly lied, but the congressional leadership aren't cops and they can only do so much absent other evidence.

The icky stuff was in the IMs.

None of this should really be any big surprise. Dr. John Money, a leading expert on sexual violence, has demonstrated a basic given: people who exist in environments where heterosexual sex is viewed as something dirty end up with deviant and warped sexual identities. Dr. David Finkelhor, a prominent expert on the study of sexual abuse of children, has conclusively demonstrated that repressive sexual attitudes linked to many religions predispose many individuals to abnormal sexual activities, which include pedophilia

Too bad for the christianistas, Dems like sex, are not ashamed of the fact, and so don't go sneaking around the pages, they wait til they're interns and of legal age.

God, these guys make the Big Dog look so damned normal

In the Islamic Middle East, where the demonization and seclusion of women has given birth to the widespread prevalence of the sexual abuse of young boys by adult males. The effects of the Taliban’s misogyny provide a perfect illustration: by depicting women as evil and restricting any possibility of male-female contact, the Taliban spawned an environment that involved the sexual exploitation and abuse of young boys that you just know that the writer was wearing a ball gag when he wrote this.

(Yawn) Blam.


The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

[It's, umm, a gag that involves a ball. What, you've never seen Pulp Fiction? - Moe Lane]

You fellas dont need to worry. You cant handle any opinions that disagree with your own so I will be limited to one post befroe being banned. So Unamerican.

[Not as much as, say, whining. But clearly you want to be tossed, so what the heck: we grant you your wish. Let us know via the contact link about how you spoke truth to power!]

[And, for the love of God, try to catch at least one Tarantino movie. You're making the blogosphere look bad. - Moe Lane]

Republican Congressman Mark Foley abruptly resigned from Congress after "sexually explicit" emails surfaced showing him flirting with a 16-year old boy.
Republican executive Randall Casseday of the conservative Washington Times newspaper was arrested for soliciting sex from a 13-year old girl on the internet.
Republican chairman of the Oregon Christian Coalition Lou Beres confessed to molesting a 13-year old girl.
Republican County Constable Larry Dale Floyd was arrested on suspicion of soliciting sex with an 8-year old girl. Floyd has repeatedly won elections for Denton County, Texas, constable.
Republican judge Mark Pazuhanich pleaded no contest to fondling a 10-year old girl and was sentenced to 10 years probation.
Republican Party leader Bobby Stumbo was arrested for having sex with a 5-year old boy.
Republican petition drive manager Tom Randall pleaded guilty to molesting two girls under the age of 14, one of them the daughter of an associate in the petition business.
Republican County Chairman Armando Tebano was arrested for sexually molesting a 14-year-old girl.
Republican teacher and former city councilman John Collins pleaded guilty to sexually molesting 13 and 14 year old girls.
Republican campaign worker Mark Seidensticker is a convicted child molester.
Republican Mayor Philip Giordano is serving a 37-year sentence in federal prison for sexually abusing 8- and 10-year old girls.
Republican Mayor Tom Adams was arrested for distributing child pornography over the internet.
Republican Mayor John Gosek was arrested on charges of soliciting sex from two 15-year old girls.
Republican County Commissioner David Swartz pleaded guilty to molesting two girls under the age of 11 and was sentenced to 8 years in prison.
Republican legislator Edison Misla Aldarondo was sentenced to 10 years in prison for raping his daughter between the ages of 9 and 17.
Republican Committeeman John R. Curtain was charged with molesting a teenage boy and unlawful sexual contact with a minor.
Republican anti-abortion activist Howard Scott Heldreth is a convicted child rapist in Florida.
Republican zoning supervisor, Boy Scout leader and Lutheran church president Dennis L. Rader pleaded guilty to performing a sexual act on an 11-year old girl he murdered.
Republican anti-abortion activist Nicholas Morency pleaded guilty to possessing child pornography on his computer and offering a bounty to anybody who murders an abortion doctor.
Republican campaign consultant Tom Shortridge was sentenced to three years probation for taking nude photographs of a 15-year old girl.
Republican racist pedophile and United States Senator Strom Thurmond had sex with a 15-year old black girl which produced a child.
Republican pastor Mike Hintz, whom George W. Bush commended during the 2004 presidential campaign, surrendered to police after admitting to a sexual affair with a female juvenile.
Republican legislator Peter Dibble pleaded no contest to having an inappropriate relationship with a 13-year-old girl.
Republican advertising consultant Carey Lee Cramer was sentenced to six years in prison for molesting two 8-year old girls, one of whom appeared in an anti-Gore television commercial.
Republican activist Lawrence E. King, Jr. organized child sex parties at the White House during the 1980s.
Republican lobbyist Craig J. Spence organized child sex parties at the White House during the 1980s.
Republican Congressman Donald "Buz" Lukens was found guilty of having sex with a female minor and sentenced to one month in jail.
Republican fundraiser Richard A. Delgaudio was found guilty of child porn charges and paying two teenage girls to pose for sexual photos.
Republican activist Mark A. Grethen convicted on six counts of sex crimes involving children.
Republican activist Randal David Ankeney pleaded guilty to attempted sexual assault on a child.
Republican Congressman Dan Crane had sex with a female minor working as a congressional page.
Republican activist and Christian Coalition leader Beverly Russell admitted to an incestuous relationship with his step daughter.
Republican Judge Ronald C. Kline was placed under house arrest for child molestation and possession of child pornography.
Republican congressman and anti-gay activist Robert Bauman was charged with having sex with a 16-year-old boy he picked up at a gay bar.
Republican Committee Chairman Jeffrey Patti was arrested for distributing a video clip of a 5-year-old girl being raped.
Republican activist Marty Glickman (a.k.a. "Republican Marty"), was taken into custody by Florida police on four counts of unlawful sexual activity with an underage girl and one count of delivering the drug LSD.
Republican legislative aide Howard L. Brooks was charged with molesting a 12-year old boy and possession of child pornography.
Republican Senate candidate John Hathaway was accused of having sex with his 12-year old baby sitter and withdrew his candidacy after the allegations were reported in the media.

Republican preacher Stephen White, who demanded a return to traditional values, was sentenced to jail after offering $20 to a 14-year-old boy for permission to perform oral sex on him.

Republican talk show host Jon Matthews pleaded guilty to exposing his genitals to an 11 year old girl.

Republican anti-gay activist Earl "Butch" Kimmerling was sentenced to 40 years in prison for molesting an 8-year old girl after he attempted to stop a gay couple from adopting her.
Republican Party leader Paul Ingram pleaded guilty to six counts of raping his daughters and served 14 years in federal prison.
Republican election board official Kevin Coan was sentenced to two years probation for soliciting sex over the internet from a 14-year old girl.
Republican politician Andrew Buhr was charged with two counts of first degree sodomy with a 13-year old boy.

Republican legislator Keith Westmoreland was arrested on seven felony counts of lewd and lascivious exhibition to girls under the age of 16 (i.e. exposing himself to children).

Republican anti-abortion activist John Allen Burt was found guilty of molesting a 15-year old girl.
Republican County Councilman Keola Childs pleaded guilty to molesting a male child.
Republican activist John Butler was charged with criminal sexual assault on a teenage girl.
Republican candidate Richard Gardner admitted to molesting his two daughters.
Republican Councilman and former Marine Jack W. Gardner was convicted of molesting a 13-year old girl.
Republican County Commissioner Merrill Robert Barter pleaded guilty to unlawful sexual contact and assault on a teenage boy.
Republican City Councilman Fred C. Smeltzer, Jr. pleaded no contest to raping a 15 year-old girl and served 6-months in prison.
Republican activist Parker J. Bena pleaded guilty to possession of child pornography on his home computer and was sentenced to 30 months in federal prison and fined $18,000.
Republican parole board officer and former Colorado state representative, Larry Jack Schwarz, was fired after child pornography was found in his possession.
Republican strategist and Citadel Military College graduate Robin Vanderwall was convicted in Virginia on five counts of soliciting sex from boys and girls over the internet.
Republican city councilman Mark Harris, who is described as a "good military man" and "church goer," was convicted of repeatedly having sex with an 11-year-old girl and sentenced to 12 years in prison.
Republican businessman Jon Grunseth withdrew his candidacy for Minnesota governor after allegations surfaced that he went swimming in the nude with four underage girls, including his daughter.
Republican campaign worker, police officer and self-proclaimed reverend Steve Aiken was convicted of having sex with two underage girls.
Republican director of the "Young Republican Federation" Nicholas Elizondo molested his 6-year old daughter and was sentenced to six years in prison.
Republican president of the New York City Housing Development Corp. Russell Harding pleaded guilty to possessing child pornography on his computer.
Republican benefactor of conservative Christian groups, Richard A. Dasen Sr., was found guilty of raping a 15-year old girl. Dasen, 62, who is married with grown children and several grandchildren, has allegedly told police that over the past decade he paid more than $1 million to have sex with a large number of young women.
Republican Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld authorized the rape of children in Iraqi prisons in order to humiliate their parents into providing information about the anti-American insurgency.

1. I love how you capitalize the word "unamerican." It suggests a blatant overuse of the word. Which leads directly to:

2. It's apparently American to let people come in to your house and pee all over your rug, all while commenting upon what sage people they are for showing you the light. Greg Lebowski, Unamerican.

3. I suppose that you've convinced yourself that the above list is mightily impressive, and will convince all who read it of the sexually perverse ways of Republicans. Perhaps it will succeed for anyone who doesn't know that there are hundreds of thousands of sex crimes reported each year and that somewhere between 25 and 40 per cent of the population self-identifies as "Republican." In other words, one would expect that, in an average year, you'd be able to compile a list of at least 60,000 or so Republicans who have committed rape. Oh, and roughly an equal number of Democrats. So what's with the incredibly poor effort that went in to this post?

Democrats bang the pages, the staffers, and whatever else doesn't put up too much resistance with alacrity. The big difference is that daddy and or mommy are appointees or government employees and think that either their child is a worth sacrifice or just aren't brave enough to lose their job over it; and rest assured, if they voiced objection to their little darling being someone's plaything, they would be banished to outer darkness. Seen it more than once.

In Vino Veritas
"Within the covers of the Bible are the answers for all the problems men face." - Ronald Reagan

How long did ABC have these IMs? Has anybody said? Where did ABC get them? Why were they reseased at this point and not earlier?

if they'd released them earlier, they might not be able to swing the election to the Dems.

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