A Kiss is Just a Kiss [Updated]

a lie is just a lie

By streiff Posted in | Comments (25) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »

What is the difference between a gaffe and full-bore-in-your-face lie? I'd submit "at least six years."

We've grown used to the utterly pathological disregard for the truth of the Clintons. All of them. From her story of being named for Sir Edmund Hillary to her purported attempt to join the Marines to her using Sinbad and Chelsea as human shields to protect herself from sniper fire in Tuzla we've all come to expect Hillary -- and Bill -- to lie to us. Not for any particular reason. They are professionals. They lie just to stay in practice.

Now we're seeing the same behavior on the part of Barack Obama.

At first, his claim to have misspoken about the Feats of Arms of his great uncle liberating Auschwitz. It was an easy enough mistake to make. One death camp is pretty much like another, I guess. And it was in one of them foreign countries. I mean who can really tell one group of foreigners from another?

Now, by way of Gateway Pundit, we have Obama telling a differently truthed version as early as October 2002. In this story it was his grandfather, not his great uncle, who helped liberate Auschwitz.

So if we accept, out of curiosity and naiveté, that someone in his family was involved in the liberation of some part of some death camp how do we explain that the person has stopped being his grandfather and now is his great uncle?

Is any part of this story true?

The notorious right wing site TalkLeft reports:

In West Virginia a few weeks ago, Obama said his grandfather enlisted the day after Pearl Harbor was bombed, which was December, 1941. [Charleston Gazette (West Virginia) April 8, 2008, Tuesday, available on Lexis.com]

"My grandfather signed up for a war the day after Pearl Harbor was bombed, fought in Patton's army. He saw the dead and dying across the fields of Europe; he heard the stories of fellow troops who first entered Auschwitz and Treblinka. He fought in the name of a larger freedom, part of that arsenal of democracy that triumphed over evil, and he did not fight in vain.

Here is the WWII Kansas Veterans Index. His grandfather, Stanley A. Dunham, enlisted in the Army on June 18 1942, six months after Pearl Harbor.

I'd also point out that Treblinka was never "liberated."

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I will direct you to two links...


This is talk left, a liberal blog. They go through each and every factual inaccuracy he has made regarding his family. The next one is Riehl World.


This says that his great uncle served in the Navy and thus wouldn't have been involved in liberating a concentration camp.

It appears that Obama may in fact pathologically make up family stories to build a narrative. This might be the thing that makes him totally unelectable.

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor

The Provocateur

I never saw TalkLeft before but it seems like a reasonable counterpart to RedState. I didn't see any bad language or excessive ad hominem statements.


I don't know anything about the site, however I will say that this particular piece is exceptionally well written and researched. It's one of the best I have read on either side of the blogosphere.

The larger point when combined with what Rhiel has found out that most likely his great uncle didn't liberate anyone either is that Obama may in fact be making up family stories to build a false narrative. If that is the case, he is through. The blogosphere must take the lead in researching all of his family stories for accuracy.

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor

The Provocateur

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

I have a less-than-family-friendly nickname for him, for his many affronts to television and cinema. He can be my human shield anytime.

As for Obama, I think the descendants of Holocaust survivors should be more concerned with some of his anti-Israel acquaintances. If he's constantly misstating which relative liberated which concentration camp, how do we know he isn't misstating his Israel policy?


I was taught that if you told a LIE - not a Gaffe - you always had to remember what you said and to whom; but, if you told the TRUTH, you only had to remember one FACT!!! BHO would be well served if he had been taught that lesson. Give me a break! How many Gaffes add up to ONE LIE?

streiff, sometimes you slay me. That's freaking hilarious.

"No compromise with the main purpose, no peace till victory, no pact with unrepentant wrong." - Winston Churchill

These are not minor details. Was it an Uncle, a Great Uncle or a Grandfather? Was he related to Obama's Grandmother who he called a "typical white woman?" Which version of the tale are we telling today? Was it the Auschwitz death camp complete with human ovens, or the labor camp at Buchenwald? Or is the whole story just made up in a failed effort to gain the Jewish vote. Obama is not to be trusted.

I suggest one more update. Take a look at what Rhiel world has discovered. His grand uncle was in the navy. He couldn't have been part of any mission to liberate a concentration camp.

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor

The Provocateur

about Riehl World's discovery. Obama's great uncle was Charles W Payne, not Charles T. But records aren't infallible. So I'm not denying their finding, in fact given what we've seen about Obama I tend to believe them, but it isn't clear enough for me to weigh in on it.

"A man does what he can and endures what he must."

your journalistic instincts are very sharp.

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor

The Provocateur

read this exchange with the asshat who owns the 89th Division website and a questioner.

"A man does what he can and endures what he must."

in my opinion it is much better to be the third person to report an accurate story than the first person to jump on an inaccurate one. You saw something that didn't make sense to you, and rather than disregarding that, and reporting it anyway, you waited until you were on solid ground.

I didn't even realize that the middle name was different. My instincts were way off.

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor

The Provocateur

What a disgusting response from a man who we would assume holds the accomplishments of "The Greatest Generation" in high regard.


It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.

I'm guessing the interview is with some 28 year old payed to run the site who has no ties at all to WWII, I'd truth the words from soldiers not 4th rate followers.

My grandfather (mother's side) fought in WWII in the Pacific. He would never, ever talk about it. Like, never ever. My Mom and my aunts would try to get him to talk about it from time to time and he would just say something to the effect of "I saw most of my friends die" and he'd leave it at that. He had a scar on his forearm, wrist to elbow and my mom (when she was a little girl) asked him about it and he said "the first guy to get to barbed wire would throw himself on it and the other guys would walk on his back to get over."

That is pretty much all that he would say about his time in the Pacific. I also have heard that out of his... I don't know the right term. He was a Master Sargeant. Out of everyone that he had with him, only 4 of them came back.

He was a lifetime Democrat. Lifetime, lifetime. He told me about how FDR's work camps allowed him to eat meat three times a day. He told me stories about Harry S Truman and that I was supposed to do three things:

1) Buy American
2) Buy Union
3) Vote Democrat

He was the Salt of the Earth.

And I can only imagine what his response would be to someone writing him a letter saying "we're fact-checking the Presumptive Democratic nominee and we'd like to confirm some of the stories he's telling about his ancestors... could you tell us about your time in the Pacific?"

This is not to say that the guy isn't an... whatever you called him.

But I thought of my grandfather when you posted that and grimaced.

Man is free at the moment he wishes to be. --Voltaire

of the family story in the Obamite scriptures, isn't it time for him to start getting the facts nailed down?

I always get confused as to whether my great-grandparents moved to America from Belgium back in 1908 or if they fought in the Civil War? Or maybe it was my second cousin, twice removed who moved to America from South Africa. I always get these tiny little facts mixed up and "mis-speak" when I am exhausted from working too hard.
No, actually when it comes to important family history I pretty much know what I am talking about, no matter what state of mind I am in.

born a third generation American of Italian descent in Brooklyn, NY.

Another part says I was born at Windsor Castle and am in the top 10 in line for the succession to the British throne.

Reconciling the two can be a handful!

Oh come on Streiff, Obama is just very tired.


It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.

Unfair. Unbalanced. Unmedicated. -- IMAO

Imagine if he had spelled potato potatoe.

What would the press have done?

They by wt259

would have written a Wikipedia entry to back him up, of course. Or re-written the dictionaries for him.

Just copying from my post in another Post.

The idea trying to be pushed that Obama wasn't lying is such a half assed attempt at clearing him.

He knew where his uncle served, he just wanted to stretch the truth so he'd get more play. If he said, "My uncle helped clear Buchenwald" Everyone would have been like "Uhhh what the hell is that?" So he stretched the truth, thus lying out his ass, by naming the most famous Nazi prison camp.

It might not have been straight out lying, but it was stretching the truth for your gain. If your going to make a big passionate speech why not check the facts? If its your big family story, passed down to you, why don't you know the facts? Is it because the story was from your evil evil white side?

Did he get this same story from the person that told him his parents met 4 years after he was born? Or that his father was with JFK? Or that MEMORIAL DAY is for living soldiers?

1 Lie and its a mistake, 20 lies and its a pattern, stop trying to make him out as a Saint.

Our greatest tools in fighting Obama will be his own sense of invulnerability and Hillary, If she loses and Doesn't get the VP nod I would expect her to "Leak" all the Obama info they have stored incase this got real close.

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