And Senator Obama breathes a sigh of relief.
This isn't one of his guys.
By Moe Lane Posted in 2008 | George McGovern | Hillary Clinton | John McCain — Comments (11) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
Unless George McGovern's switched recently, that is.
Some years ago, I was on one of the networks with former Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara, one of the chief architects of the war in Vietnam. But the reason I was on television that night is he had just come out with a new book saying that the war was not only it was a mistake, in his words it was a tragic mistake. Well, in the course of that three-way discussion, which included in addition to Secretary McNamara and myself, Sen. John McCain. And in McCain's first opening remarks, he said, well we all know that George McGovern knows little about national defense.
Let me tell you what I would say to John McCain: neither of us is an expert on national defense. It's true that you went to one of the service academies but you were in the bottom of the class. It's true that you were a pilot in Vietnam, that you were shot down and spent most of the war in prison and we all sympathize with that and honor you for your courage. But you and I both had these battle experiences, you as a Navy fighter plane, I as an army bomber. I am not going to criticize your war record and your knowledge of national security but I don't want you criticizing mine either.
If I'd be allowed just one little dig at Senator McCain, since he gave me. I would say, 'John, you were shot down early in the war and spent most of the time in prison. I flew 35 combat missions with a 10-man crew and brought them home safely every time.'
(Via The Campaign Spot)
:shrug: Democrats.
« Dueling June Obama fundraising claims? — Comments (2) | I can only presume that these were rhetorical questions. — Comments (1) »
And Senator Obama breathes a sigh of relief. 11 Comments (0 topical, 11 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »
With all due respect (A LOT of respect) to Senator McGovern's service....John McCain was shot down on his 23rd mission, then spent 5 1/2 years as a POW. We all know how he was treated by the enemy. I would say McGovern flying his 35 and going home got the better end of the deal.
Furthermore, I think its safe to assume that John McCain was a guest of the North Vietnamese longer than George McGovern was actually in the military period...certainly longer then he was on active duty.
Finally, does McGovern disrespect McCain by making the statement he (McGovern) brought his crew home safely every time? If so, he disrespects every man who died trying to bring his people home, but didn't get it done. Now, do I think McGovern actually feels this way? No.....But it shows how ill conceived his comments are.
originally designed as a subsonic fighter and heavily used in Vietnam as a fighter-bomber. It was enough of a fighter that the Top Gun program used it as the Agressor for quite a while, but it would also carry a heavy ordinance load.
In Vino Veritas
until they switched to F/A 18s. I saw them with the Skyhawks at Elmendorf AFB in Anchorage in the late '70s, early '80s. Even though by comparison to the F-4 that preceded it and the F/A 18 that replaced it the A-4 was a small, simple aircraft, it was so maneuverable that they really put on a show with it.
In Vino Veritas
Yes, you're right, the A-4 mission was usually as a bomber, but it was also air combat capable as a fighter and a good match for the Mig 17-19 and even the -21 at low altitude. Likewise, the F-4 was used more as a fighter bomber in the bomber role than as a pure air defense or CAP fighter - as well as the F-100 and the F-105, used in all both roles as well as the Wild Weasel SAM supression role. The true fighter on the Navy side was the F-8 Vigilante, used almost exclusively in the air defense role. The true bomber on the Navy side was the A-6 Intruder, but A-7s were also used in the bomber role.
Feel better now?
In Vino Veritas
If McCain was a "fighter" rather than a "bomber" pilot, I confess my error and offer my apology.
None of this changes the fact that McGovern took a cheap shot at McCain's service experience.
John McCain flew A-4 Skyhawks off the aircraft carrier Forrestall during Vietnam. I think they are typically referred to as fighter aircraft vs. bombers which would typically be B-1s, B-52s, etc.
....if some Republican had 'gotten one little dig in' by referring to Kerry's Purple Hearts as Vietnamese Marksmanship Medals and commenting about how careless he was to get shot 4 times in so short a period.
Fortuna Favet Fortibus
Obviously, getting shot down means failure to them.
However, there is a reason they call it "the fog of war": there is so much randomness. Potential winners of multiple Medals of Honor are never given the opportunity, because battle passes them by. The best tacticians are sometimes defeated by overwhelming force. And no amount of skill on the part of the Viet Nam era pilot could keep him from being shot down. It was luck.
What does assure returning home safely is cutting the mission short. Perhaps that is the nature of Mr. McGovern's criticism, that Senator McCain was overly zealous in accomplishing his missions.
--
Gone 2500 years, still not PC.
no guarantee that you have a clue about national security. See: McGovern, Carter, Kerry, Gore, Murtha, Conyers, Wes Clark & a host of Generals for current and blatent examples.
____
CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.