McCain Continues Shafting Conservatives
By Erick Posted in 2008 | John McCain — Comments (44) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
UPDATE: CFG invited McCain to speak on either March 31st or April 1st. McCain will be in Iraq during that time and be unavailable.
------
I'm confused. I thought John McCain was a conservative. Of course he tells everyone who will listen that he is one.
Then of course, there is the real John McCain. He's the one who skipped CPAC, then tried to organize a private event at the same hotel at the same time. When confronted, he railed against the CPAC leadership. Apparently, John McCain does not like to hang out with social conservatives.
Now there is the Club For Growth's annual winter meeting. All the other candidates are going to be there. McCain? Nope, not for him. Hanging out with the fiscal conservatives is not his thing either.
So, exactly what kind of conservative is John McCain?
« Dueling June Obama fundraising claims? — Comments (2) | Hillary Says President Bush 'Deliberately' Strained the Military — Comments (10) »
McCain Continues Shafting Conservatives 44 Comments (0 topical, 44 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »
McCain hates conservatives. Old news.
I sure hope that Romney starts picking up in the polls soon. I'm becoming more and more nervous about the prospect of a Giuliani or McCain nomination.
I am not a McCain '08 supporter, but I'm going to attempt an explanation at the CPAC and CfG snubs.
McCain probably feels his name recognition is high enough that he can get his message out without having to go through the traditional "gatekeepers". Maybe he's decided that many in the general population (the folks who don't pay attention until a week before the general) equate these gatekeepers with "special interests" or "fringe groups." Maybe he's getting a little sensitive about the fact that his maverick status is being questioned now that he's tried to mend fences with Falwell and religious voters.
That McCain would treat CPAC or CfG as though their support is not needed or wanted is certainly not going to build any bridges with conservatives, but I guess he's made the calculation that he can win without those bridges???
OK, look: it was just an attempt.
______________________________________
"Our job is to bash the president"
Newsweek's Evan Thomas, on the role of the MSM
But considering he needs to gain traction against Romney and Rudy and those two are going to these places -- and Rudy to CPAC where he was clearly an outsider -- McCain needs to remember he is running in a primary, not a general.
if a Fred Thompson candidacy (or any other candidate/event that could cause conservative voters to unify) would get McCain to reevaluate the need to actually run a primary campaign. Of course, if conservatives are unified, McCain's toast anyway, so maybe there's some method to his madness.
______________________________________
"Our job is to bash the president"
Newsweek's Evan Thomas, on the role of the MSM
I just think it's terrible reasoning. I'm not deeply offended here, just puzzled by why anybody would think this is good strategy.
"No compromise with the main purpose, no peace till victory, no pact with unrepentant wrong." - Winston Churchill
Which is a better indicator of commitment to fiscal responsibility? A record spanning decades of commitment to the cause, or an appearance to pander to organizations like the Club for Growth? If someone like Thad Cochran were to speak at the CfG, would that make him more of a fiscal conservative than John McCain?
I think the truth of the matter is that you are looking for reasons to dislike John McCain, which is why you're taking his declining of invitations personally. I don't need him to kiss the ass of Pat Toomey to know that McCain is serious about fiscal responsibility.
There's no doubt that a stringent litmus test is being applied to the '08 candidates (mostly McCain), but you have to ask yourself: is the litmus test you're applying one based on policy and record, or one based on something as superficial as an appearance at a conference? Because if the basis of your support is a guy jumping through all the hoops that you've set up for him, then you're asking for a weak candidate. I'll take a candidate whose record of fiscal responsibility speaks for itself over that any day of the week.
Fiscal conservatism is only part of the Economic Freedom pie. John McCain's record on the other areas is kind of spotty, though it definitely has its strong points.
This whole critique of “so-and-so didn’t show up at the right events so let’s gossip about how much we hate him” is utterly juvenile. Pretty much the only people who place any importance on these events are the sort of schmoozers who are into politics because they’re looking to advance a career in politics by getting a job with the “right” people or who want to stay in good with the “in crowd” by going to all the right parties.
For those of us who didn’t stop our social development at the high school level, it’s not so important and I see no reason to feel “slighted” because John McCain or anyone else didn’t go.
I'm not a South Park Republican, I'm a King of the Hill libertarian.
Any more pompous in your comment Thorley?
Actually, people go to these events because it:
(1) connects them with the grassroots;
(2) connects them with deep pockets;
(3) connects them with a hellavalot of free press, which in John McCain's case has been decidedly negative since he skipped the events.
Look, I realize you are too good for the grassroots, but I would expect a Presidential candidate to want to be around them.
The grassroots aren't going to be there for him. That's a given. I wouldn't expect the grassroots to rally around any of the top three candidates, but I guess the non-stop pandering by Romney and Guiliani has paid off, slightly.
And while there are pockets to pick from at these type of events, McCain's primary source of fundraising are from people who like him for who he is, not for who he pretends to be. He could swing down to the Club for Growth and be able to pick up some money on the way, but he would most likely be doing so at the expense of more money from other donors.
And I disagree that McCain's press has been decidely negative. Certainly, it would be more negative if he were present at CoulterPAC, for various reasons. Skipping CPAC was his best play, especially in the aftermath, and skipping the CfG won't get much attention. It may burn some hearts on the conservative blogosphere, but honestly, I think everybody is pretty used to that by now. I don't see a "straw that breaks the camel's back" in terms of how many negative stories the grassroots can come up with.
The grassroots aren't going to be there for him. That's a given.
It's not a given, but it sure seems to be his goal.
McCain has decided to cast his lot in with the MSM to 'get his message out'. He doesn't want to be linked to conservatives, believing that all he has to do is win the primaries and the conservatives will have nowhere to go.
It's a losing strategy, both in terms of electoral politics and the ability to govern if he were to manage to get elected.
--
See the Academy
Attendance at these events is important because it says, "I stand with these guys, and I stand for what they stand for." It can be a bold message.
Or, in the case of Rudy at CPAC it was more along the lines of, "These are the things we have in common, and I stand with you on these principles. We all know where we don't have common ground, but I still respect you enough to come and ask for your vote and support. At the very least, if you cannot support, me, I ask that you respect me and agree to disagree, in a civil manner."
John McCain just shoots the right the middle finger every chance he can get, and then he tells/lectures us that we should vote for him.
Honestly, if he's as diplomatic with the international community as he is with conservatives, American foreign policy would be in deep trouble under a President McCain.
Except for the last paragraph. Your basic idea is right, but I would say that if McCain approaches foreign policy this way, he will distance himself from our allies and rely on the U.N. for approval. Maybe moderates and the left will like that, but not I don't.
--
See the Academy
I again ask, which is more important to you: one's record or one's attendence? If Bill Richardson were to show up at the Club for Growth, and say "I respect you enough to come here and ask for your vote, and though we don't agree on all issues, here are the principles on which we can both get behind," does that make him more conservative your eyes, than someone like John McCain?
McCain's line is, "I'm my own candidate, not a product of or a panderer to the right-wing of my party". Its not a chance to flip the middle-finger, its a chance to be an independent candidate.
I personally think the litmus test for our candidates should be higher than "Did he tell me what I want to hear and shake my hand?" I'm fine with voting for McCain, without him even asking for it.
then he's an arrogant _ _ _ _ _ _ _ . . . which, come to think of it, is how he usually comes across.
A candidate who wanted to win the nomination would show up at Club for Growth; respect the fact that they're a player in the process (they can leave the debate of "how big a player?" for later); acknowledge there are areas where he disagrees; make the case for why his positions (even those they don't like) are, in reality, consistent with their goals; and ask them for their support notwithstanding their differences.
The goal isn't to "convert" Club for Growth (that probably can't be done), it is (or should be) to make himself "less unacceptable" to them.
McCain's going to need people who will hold their nose and vote for him "because stopping Hillary is what matters" if he wants to get the nomination / get elected. Dissing avowedly conservative podiums isn't going to help him find them.
He has given me plenty of obvious ones. As to his fiscal stance, it is good on spending, not so good on taxes, or much else for that matter. Honestly and truly I would rather a democrat in the office than McCain, because, the republicans in the congress would actually work to defeat a democrat, but might not do anything to defeat a mad-man McCain.
"Nothing works like freedom, Nothing succeeds like liberty"
Kyle
Do you really think McCain would grovel at the feet of Club for Growth, or are you saying him simply speaking to them would be "pandering?"
IMO, you're missing a pretty obvious explanation for why McCain might wish to stiff Club for Growth: McCain has a very thin skin for criticism and is demonstrably protective of his little "club", a/k/a the United States Senate (witness "Gang of 14").
Club for Growth has made a name for itself by supporting conservative challengers against incumbent politicians - including (for example) Lincoln Chafee. They ran adds against Chafee, ads I suspect McCain would describe as unfair & wrong ... you know, the type of ads McCain's legislation seeks to ban.
As for McCain's "commitment to fiscal responsibility", one can be fiscally responsible in many ways - - - - at the extremes, one can argue that taxes should be increased until the revenue raised supports the full level of spending desire or that spending should be cut to the level of revenue the current tax code generates.
McCain's been putting himself more & more on the "Bob Dole", i.e., "tax collector for the welfare state", end of that spectrum.
Sure, he rails against spending ... and what does he actually do about it?
Did he join with Coburn re: earmarks?
I don't think so; if McCain had been leading that charge, we wouldn't know who Tom Coburn was.
Can anyone find an instance where McCain's leadership actually led to a reduction in discretionary spending ..... or does he just mouth the words about appropriations which he knows are going through with or without him?
And why does he use Democrat talking points in opposing tax cuts?
McCain talks like a Democrat about tax cuts; about Global Warming; about campaign finance "reform"; give me the education about the economic matters where he talks like a Republican.
I'm willing to be educated here.
This just in ... more bad news for McCain, fellow conservative senator David Vitter just announced his endorsement of Giuliani, saying his leadership is needed -- and that he's convinced Rudy isn't running to advance a liberal social agenda.
---
The truth is, the more you tax profits, the more you undermine the American work ethic and the incentive structure that goes along with it. In fact, you demoralize the very system that has made this country great.
Vitter is one of my faves (w/ DeMint, Brownback).
Rudy? Really?
______________________________________
"Our job is to bash the president"
Newsweek's Evan Thomas, on the role of the MSM
The kind who is a rude, insensitive jerk, who constantly ticks you off, but- most of the time- votes the right way.
Not that I'm a McCain fan- one of those times he voted the wrong way was on the McCain-Feingold censorship bill, and that it an issue that really turns me off from supporting him.
On the other hand, I have to admitt that McCain usually comes down on the right side when the votes are counted- it's just that he likes to kick on the way the voting booth.
The fact that he seems to particularly enjoy kicking his friends and allies is vexing, but not a deal killer to me.
Still McCain is definately not my first choice fro President(or even my third).
That's easy: the kind who isn't.
Regards,
Nate Nelson
Reality Mugged Me
He does appear to be honestly patriotic, and Patriotism is something that is important to all three legs of the Conservative Movement. How are his Neo-Con credentials? Perhaps he is a Neo-Con.
...a long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right...
---Thomas Paine---
It's good that McCain is patriotic, but so are a lot of politicians - including a lot of Democrats. Should we vote for them?
The problem with patriotism is that it's somewhat abstract. What will Patriot McCain do about taxes? Say "God bless America" and sign the We Will Tax You to Death Act of 2009? What will Patriot McCain do about campaign finance reform? Wave the flag while he's signing a bill that restricts freedom of speech in the area where it's needed the most, political debate?
Patriotism is good, but you need something to distinguish you from a soccer mom in order to be President.
Regards,
Nate Nelson
Reality Mugged Me
I was not attempting to say that Patriotism is enough to make one a Conservative, but that he does exhibit it, and since many leftist (socialists, progressives, etc) are ether uncomfortable with the concept or out rightly opposed to Patriotism, then perhaps there is a chance he is a Neo-Con (I am not familiar enough with his voting/position history to determine if he is or is not a Neo-Con). He defiantly is not an Economic or Social Conservative.
...a long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right...
---Thomas Paine---
We currently have Guiliani killing children to cut down on crime.
Mitt "What would you like the answer to be" Romney
and John "The liberals conservative" McCain.
Maybe we will get lucky and Newt will enter the race.
______________________________
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
the word is that Rudy also killed off all the homeless people to reduce crime. At least he isn't ageist.
______________________________________
"Our job is to bash the president"
Newsweek's Evan Thomas, on the role of the MSM
Surely he's as tough as Dick Cheney, isn't he?
--
See the Academy
Can we get McCain and Romney evicted ?
______________________________
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
a social liberal because he did not attend CPAC, and he is a fiscal liberal for not attending CFG. I guess being in favor of pubic funding for Abortion is a great example social and fiscal conservatism. Actions mean a whole lot more to me than attending conventions. Many you seem to say that you are completely ready to vote for a candidate that says " hey I'm a liberal" if they come to your little meeting.
But will never, ever, ever, make any effort to talk the talk.
He's a Ted Kennedy Conservative.
I mean really. In 9 months, no one will be talking about what meetings McCain went to and who he did or did not talk to.
If you disagree with him, that's fine. But calling him a liberal is just plain inaccurate and quite frankly ignorant of reality. His voting record is well in line with the mainstream of our party.
http://michiganformccain.blogspot.com/
"In war, my dear friends, there's no such thing as compromise. You either win or you lose."
-John McCain
Look what the Club for Growth did to McCain's buddy Joe Schwarz in the Michigan 7th Congressional District. They raped Joe Schwarz, the guy who ran McCain's campaign in Michigan in 2000.
Oops! That's right. There is no such thing.
Kyoto Now! (Because only pollution from the US hurts the planet)
Those arguing that McCain needs to be given a pass for not talking the talk of Conservatism because he has a "Conservative voting record" are missing a VERY important point. Conservatism is an intellectual movement. It needs to be sold to the populous every day in order to have a chance of overcoming the lazy emotional arguments that will always be out there for liberalism. The head of the conservative party needs to be the biggest cheerleader for conservatism, always making the case for the superiority of our philosophy.
I would say that John McCain is NOT Conservative on too many issues that are important to me, but even if he was, he would NEVER be my candidate, because he will not make the case. It is as if he has to hold his nose to deal with the likes of us, and that is not how you win converts to your philosophy.
In the long run, we would be much better off losing with a candidate that would press the case for Conservatism, like Newt Gingrich or others, than to win with someone like McCain. That being said, I am also of the opinion that McCain is the ONLY Republican that would lose to Hillary. Once his main constituency, the MSM, turned on him and highlighted his temperament problems among others, he would be toast.
Conservatism is an intellectual movement. It needs to be sold to the populous every day in order to have a chance of overcoming the lazy emotional arguments that will always be out there for liberalism.
Outstanding quote.
(FYI: it's "populace")
--
See the Academy
I know McCain has enemies in the movement and I assume he's concerned that he will get a harsh reception. And I know he doesn't want to be seen changing his positions to cater to conservatives. But I would think it would make more strategic sense to show respect by showing up and asking for votes.
"No compromise with the main purpose, no peace till victory, no pact with unrepentant wrong." - Winston Churchill