Obama Might Just Blow It

This is Not the Moderate You are Looking For

By Mark I Posted in | | | | Comments (119) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »

The biggest danger to Sen. Barack Obama's campaign comes not from his Republican opponent, Sen. John McCain, nor from his former rival, Sen. Hillary Clinton, but from Barack Obama himself. Obama has sold himself as a new kind of politician, even an anti-politician, a practitioner of a new kind of politics. The Achilles heel of this strategy is that Obama is not really that different from other politicians; and if he can be shown to be just like every other candidate, save for his eloquence, voters who invested in him on a personal level may begin to feel like they have been had.

The past week provided Obama with a few opportunities to show that he really is a different kind of candidate, indeed a different kind of Democrat, than the standard variety. But in each instance, he espoused the typical liberal position.

Read on...

The Supreme Court's wrongheaded decision in Boumediene, for the first time granting habeas corpus rights to terrorist detainees, was embraced by the "different" Obama as an important step in preserving civil liberties for American citizens. But the decision has nothing to do with Americans. It grants the rights of Americans to non-Americans who want to harm American citizens, but it does not one thing to advance any American's civil liberties. Obama's embrace of the decision may just as well have come from the American Civil Liberties Union, Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International, or any other far left liberal watchdog group. Obama missed an opportunity to take a "new politics" position on terrorists, in favor of a garden variety liberal one.

Obama then compounded his error by holding out the example of the 1993 World Trade Center bombing as a model for how an Obama Administration would deal with terrorists and terrorist acts. He assessed the trial and conviction of the terrorists in that first Islamic terrorist attack on American shores as having been a success. "They are in U.S. prisons, incapacitated," he boasted of the terrorists responsible. He did not address how, if the trial and conviction of those terrorists was so successful, the September 11th attacks took place. Clearly, the trial did nothing to prevent further acts of terrorism on America at home or abroad. Obama missed a chance to take a post-September 11th position on terrorists, a more robust one than federal prosecutors can implement, in favor of a tired old liberal worldview.

But Obama was not finished. He capped off the week by suggesting that if Osama bin Laden himself were captured alive during an Obama Administration, the mastermind of the murder of more Americans than any other person in history would not be subjected to the death penalty. Obama said that the U.S. should deal with a captured bin Laden in a way that does, "not make him a martyr." That may be a popular position in the liberal salons of Cambridge and New Haven, but it is not one that will resonate with an overwhelming majority of Americans. Even those personally opposed to capital punishment will have a hard time finding any sympathy for bin Laden's soul. Obama could have easily said that bin Laden deserved "ultimate justice" for his crimes, or some other suitable euphemism for execution, and he would have been praised as a "new" kind of Democrat, tough on terrorism. But instead he went out of his way to take the liberal position, even for the worst of America's enemies.

Since securing the nomination, Obama has been trying to tack back to the center, walking back pledges to meet personally and unconditionally with the leaders of Iran, Syria, North Korea, Cuba, and Venezuela. But there's nothing new about that strategy either. Presidential candidates since time immemorial have campaigned to the fringes in the primary and to the center in the general election. What is new about Obama, however, is the length to which he has gone to convince voters that his greasy fast food served on fine china is really nouveau cuisine. It's not. If Obama doesn't start to come up with some genuinely new positions and fresh ideas, he will lose in November, and become just another bitter liberal former nominee.

Cross Posted at Mark on the Right

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...on either side really thought/thinks Obama would wash politics of its sins they were/are nuts. It's a branding device. I happen to think that apart from that branding device Obama does, in fact, offer a way to transcend certain barriers, but that's mainly due to the fact that he's so new to the Federal scene, and there hasn't been a build-up of animus. Bush had the same advantage when he came into office, defrayed as it was a little bit by the whole Florida thing.

But, at some point and for Republican's own benefit, there has to be an introspective and internal attempt to settle McCain down on these exact sort of flipflops and off message meanderings. Otherwise, all these examples of Obama "blowing it" will be neutralized by McCain going out of his way to contradict himself. And it's a big worry because McCain has been filmed and filmed and filmed during the past 20 years saying all sorts of things, whereas Obama has not. The haunting back catalog is more McCain's problem than Obama's, at this point. It's the payoff of Democrats buying "short" on experience.

But what really matters is how each side keeps their candidate's feet to the fire -- though not on doctrinaire, ideological issues, the primaries are over, it's a binary race now, ideology should be a dead field of intra-party battle -- but on the issue of settling down and not trying to make this a war of how many positions can one take.

Both sides can afford to have their candidate simply say nothing on certain issues. But instead many times they demand the candidate say something. There haven't been very many McCain posts on RedState, so I imagine the front-pagers already know this, for the most part. But that is what the online base should be looking for: the candidate to know when to shut up.

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Which tends to make him a very old sort of politician. One most of us are painfully familiar with.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...but if I read correctly he also -- because of his statement that he wanted a small-donor funded, non-527 campaign -- caused MoveOn to cease its 527. Could there be a more tangible, more happy development for American politics?

Although, I generally vote Democratic, so maybe that's why I'm so happy MoveOn has been sidelined. You guys must be a little sad about that...

initially. You have to ask what is going on ?

You believe moveon has been sidelined ?? Personally that would have me jumping for joy. They are pernicious and a very negative influence on politics. However I don't for one moment believe they are sidelined or have abandoned their creation.

Me so far I am happy as well. While I may not be 100% on board with my candidate. I don't feel compelled to excuse his actions.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...the obsession with money itself being the root of all evil in politics has never been my personal obsession. The campaign funding strategy Obama is undertaking is fine with me. So I, too, don't feel compelled to excuse his actions insofar as I agree with them.

I think MoveOn is clearly not one of Obama's favorite organizations, they endorsed him stupidly, IMO. Once, while overseas, when Petraeus came into his position, I made a joke about how he would only "Betray us." It was a joke, solely a pun on his name. MoveOn actually went with it, in seriousness, and ran an ad. I thought and think that was stupid and false.

So maybe I'm indulging in a bit of wishful thinking. But if MoveOn has cut off its big ad-making arm -- the source of most of its publicity-seeking nonsense -- I do think that's a positive step forward for everyone.

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I was raised to look down on that sort of thing.

The money doesn't matter to me.

...and here I was raised to believe cowboys were world-wise and were suitably skeptical of federal power to know how the government worked!

I assume you'll be writing in Jesus as president, as concerned as you are with having a non-Janus politician in power?

Please. It's a bipartisan issue with me to completely dismiss people who are idealistic toward the ends of their own compromise of ideals. It's a self-revealing absurdity.

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But is this what you come up with ??

So sue him he's corrupt ?

I mean really haven't you been pulling a "Don't look behind the curtain, He is the mighty and Powerful Obama" ?


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...but I'll say that Obama is a politician. He's gearing to win votes and not souls, he's winning electoral votes and not plaudits from his base. Plus, and this is weird for me, he's kept making the exact same decisions and maneuvers I would've. It's such a strange situation for me. I don't know how to react when a politician does what I would pragmatically do, it's never happened before. And he's doing well!

I guess what I'm getting at is that I was behind the curtain already, and all of a sudden this other guy showed up behind those curtains who was ahead in the national presidential polls. It was amazing. I can only hope the idiots are confused by what Obama really is, a good centrist, well-branded, candidate.

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You are right in describing his campaign as branding because that is exactly what it resembles.

He is being sold in exactly the way frosted flakes and tylenol are sold. Off teleprompter he is non existent. He has a rogues gallery of of advisers that make the tylenol cyanide scare look minor. Finally he is already failing at his promises and he isn't even in office.

Your response, AHAHA he is an excellent politician look how skillfully he lies ??


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...to your characterization of Obama's campaign. I object to the implicit assertion that your side is doing anything different. Politics is what it is: a combination of idealism and pragmatism that both saints and satanists will find wholly unappealing.

It's all about the mix of those two that one thinks will benefits the most Americans, and that -- thanks to the near-infinite complexity of our system -- is open to debate.

And, hopefully, that's the field the good conversations take place.

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taken Rezko subsidized house deals, and been friends with the unrepentant terrorist Ayres, not to mention talking like Chairman Mao? Centrist my... well you know.
Tim Schieferecke

...I wouldn't have. But if I'm running for president I'm not aware of it yet. You play the hand you're dealt.

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If he's been going off about how Obama ejaculates roses, it hasn't been here.

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!

It seems addison has been using

"But Everybody does it" as the excuse for Obama

and then pulling a little sleight of hand when anyone points out Obama's brand is that he isn't everybody.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

I feel like this is directed at a point where I should be able to respond, and willing, but I'm not quite sure what you mean.

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Here
http://www.redstate.com/stories/elections/2008/obama_might_jut_blow_it#c...

Here
http://www.redstate.com/stories/elections/2008/obama_might_jut_blow_it#c...

And Here
http://www.redstate.com/stories/elections/2008/obama_might_jut_blow_it#c...

Claiming you had evidence when all you have is blank paper went out with Jack Anderson.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...I KNOW that Obama is hypocritical -- he's a pragmatic politician -- I wanted your personal opinion about how that wasn't going to work for the Democrats.

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Personally I don't like doing it. But the customers like negotiating directly with the owner rather than a salesman.

BTW If you are ever buying anything from a small company yourself let the salesdog make the pitch then shunt him aside to negotiate directly with the owner.

Anyway back on topic. The reason I don't like it, is that I have to be exceptionally careful with my words. It doesn't matter if what I said is correct I have to convey the correct impression as well. If I don't I create problems in the relationship which is a big big problem.

What Obama is doing is deliberately conveying a false impression that gets dispelled on a regular basis. John Kerry asserting he has integrity, John Edwards Two Americas, Al Gore trying to be a Human Being all come to mind.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

Breaking promises is what is expected from a politician in a campaign. Obama is just run of the mill as far as I am concerned.

But when you do it man to man, one on one, it makes it more personal. It makes you a bald faced liar.
I didn't expect you to get it.

...that every Obama voter is a stars-in-the-eyes lunatic, that's something you're gonna need to work on now. That's a delusion common among everyone BUT potential Obama voters.

Everyone who was expecting Obama to be the new Messiah is voting either for Nader, McCain, or for no one at this point. No Obama supporter is on-board with the cartoon version of his candidacy.

The GOP's starting point right now is Bush's unpopularity and how to deal with that vis-a-vis McCain.

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But lying is disliked universally

"No Obama supporter is on-board with the cartoon version of his candidacy."

You must have a very large circle of friends to be able to makes statements like this, and none of them must be in the national media.

The only reason that Obama made it as far as he did is his Messianic glow. And it's not "cartoonish" as you say, it's a carefully crafted image that has been birthed out of his, his wife's, Oprah's and a number of preacher's mouths. It's in his slogans and on his posters.

His positions on almost every issue were nearly identical to Hillary Clinton's but she had far more experience than he does. The same goes for Biden, Dodd and Edwards, except moreso. If elected, he will bring nothing to the office of president that his fellow candidates wouldn't have brought x10.

He began winning early, when the glow was still bright. But then began tapering off after the Rev. Wright revelations, when people began realizing that he was a mere mortal politician.

His supporters still speak in vague terms like "change" and "hope" but are unable to articulate his beliefs or explain the policies that he will enact to create the wonderful world that he speaks of so forcefully. Perhaps that's because they don't know what those policies or beliefs are because his dearest friend, mentor, promise or belief is discarded like a used up paper towel as soon as they are no longer politically expedient.

He really is the oldest kind of politician. He is a Sophist. He says what he needs to say to aquire what he wants to aquire. He appears to have no guiding principle whatsoever except for the aquisition of power for the simple purpose of aquiring it.

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As an African-American I cannot simply dismiss Obama's perspective because it defies conventional wisdom or business-as-usual in politics. He stands for civil liberties because of the years of oppression that we have endured. He wants to dialogue because he has seen what violence and hatred have done domestically and internationally. Obama wants justice above all.

Obama will not stop at trying to reconcile the US with the rest of the world... he will try to unite us all in this nation as well. He will fix the broken economy. Health care will be on par with our world status (the best). Racial tensions that have existed will be erased... but first he must do justice... he must give reparations for slavery and change the way that the people are represented in government. If you are worried about what he has said so far... you better believe that a new day is coming and he will bring justice to America... it's about time.

Our allies.

It will be amazing to see the havoc he might cause if actually allowed to take office.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...it's just a very deft, very smart utilization of those things. Obama is an excellent centrist politician, he has displayed a great balance in his use of pragmatic politics framed as a transcendent persona. He's smart. He's tough. That's why we Democrats like him. But the more Obama is framed as Ghandi, the more self-destruction his campaign will be. Thank goodness he understand that. And, besides, right now America doesn't need a Ghandi as president, it needs a Churchill. Most here don't see Obama has even approaching that, but at least that should be the thing aspired to.

Thinking Obama will be the snake oil that heals our nation's every wound is a delusion. The machinery of politics will still be the machinery things get done through, and to think Obama won't be just another operator of said machinery is ridiculous.

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I would like to nominate this as the most typo-strewn mess of a comment this week.

If I win I get a RedState.com hat, right?

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Where has Obama ever shown that he doesn't want to be framed as Ghandi?

...to spin his own cloth for his suits or harvest salt from the sea.

Seriously, come up with a better prompt for a debate that this. Don't attack politicians for being politicians when EVERY politician pretends not to be a politician. It's silly. It's very silly. Obama gets away with it and you're mad, ok. Well for me to think that this is a suitable field of debate is to give way too much credence to envy than seems advisable.

Put your effort into getting McCain to up his game, not trying to get Obama's voters to stop playing theirs.

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Without that, he's just a far left part of the Chicago machine.

HTML Help for Red Staters

...is working so far. It's our own "uniter not a divider." Why would I denounce it? And the more the GOP denounces "HopeChange" the more that general idea gets embedded into the national psyche. Attacking Obama on his branding is counterproductive, you've got to make McCain get on his game more, not try to chop Obama's legs off. IMO.

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I doubt W got one vote out of his. So if Barry does that will be a change.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...and so I was alright with his 2000 win for a little while. It wasn't what I wanted, but I figured he was a reasonable. I doubt 2008 will be much different. The idea of a truce is powerful.

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to know at what point, time , event that you ceased to be "alright" with Bush.

He has never fought back and has refused to defend himself. Look what it has gotten him.

...is the point where all transcendent politicians meet their doom to the other side. Obama, Bush, anyone.

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They have already drunk the kool-aid. They are not going to another person for a new batch. McCain cannot win by trying to be Obama-lite. The only way to stop Obama is to reveal him to be the snake-oil salesman that he is. If the campaign is about HopeChange then Obama wins and McCain looses. If it is about real issues then Obama looses.

"Racial tensions that have existed will be erased..." Of course they will -- he'll just click his heels and all will be well...

Yeah right.

and stop drinking it now.

*****
Unrepentant African-American nationalist, Unapologetic African-American conservative!

I see nothing more divisive than a full-court press for some kind of reparations for slavery, especially since among those who live in the U.S., you can neither identify who is in need of receiving payment, nor can you identify who is liable for payment.

Any effort to create such a binary model will utterly polarize the country along race lines, as we start assigning innocence and culpability on the basis of blood lineage. And just who is going to decide the ancestry percentages?

Justice, you dare appeal to justice. The blood of hundreds of thousands of Americans in the War between the States wasn't payment enough?

The rest of you piece promotes the same starting point that is the prime turn-off to Obama for many of us: the origin that America is the locus of evil in this world and the oppressor of the other nations. It's that secularized conviction of American as original sin that permeates and undermines the rest of your message.

And Rightly So!

...into a reparations scheme when I can document that none of my ancestors was ever an American slave-owner*.

Right, of course: people who believe in reparations look at me and judge me on the color of my skin; not the content of my character.

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!

*I make no claim for my primitive Irish ancestors, but they weren't in the habit of practicing racial slavery anyway.

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

Your European ancestors benefited indirectly from the American slave trade. If any of them lived here in the hundred years following the American Civil War, they reaped the fruit of discrimination and segregation. If you have ever eaten any portion of one of the millions of sharks which still troll the old slave ship routes looking for dead slaves overboard, you owe, buddy.

It wuould be nice if Obama goes whole hog for reparations, but I suspect that his base will be yet again disappointed. What is McCain's position on reparations? Is he clear on the fact that pandering on reparations is completely unacceptable? I hate that I even have to ask.

reparations to any living former slave.
Otherwise,I would guess that most of our ancestors were slaves at some point. So to whom do I present a bill?

Chris you speak as a matter of factly of him. What proof have you of him actually acheiving this? His lack of experience?
his exploitation of an era (60s) and playing with people's emotions? those who remenince about the music and the flower child and the once who endured the miscarriage of justice at the time.That era is gone.the young people today could never duplicate the genius of the sixtes with their computer savyy. that music is gone and that injustice is whiped out of our books. Those lyrics should not be exploited for the sake of an election Would you deny this? The proof that Obama wherever he is from or what color he is is running for the highest office in the land. Is that proof enough for you? The government cannot control how you feel or how the white person feels but it sure did what was needed to be done regarding civil rights and liberty. Counterbalance that with any other country in the world today. Obama is not only stirring the pot he is watering down the soup.If you catch my drift.
The govenment with MLK are the ones who take credit for how we enjoy our civil rights today. Not Obama.You just can't have a movement if you don't know how to write lyrics. Just copy the past does not do it for me. He shattered my dream. That is what he did. Sorry but he is not the African American I envisionned to be proud to vote for.

Well-stated, except for the following:

The govenment with MLK are the ones who take credit for how we enjoy our civil rights today.

I think if you look at this again that you'll realize that it's people along with MLK who brought about the civil rights revolution, not some amorphous "government". It was whites and blacks working together to create the societal conversation and development of consensus that enabled the necessary civil rights legislative (starting in 1964) to be enacted and to be largely accepted over a short period of time.

(Unlike judicial mandates that short-circuit the societal and consensus-building process and thus have peretuated rancid devisions even 35+ years later - but that's the topic for another thread: to elaborate here would be thread-jacking)

And in particular, if you take a closer look at the South at that time, it was especially the white churches and the white Christians who undercut the underpinnings to segregation by progressively denying it moral cover and preparing the ground for the destruction of the structures of segregation.

It's not my goal, though, to play the "who gets the most credit" game; rather I wanted to emphasize that it was individuals and local associations that brought an effective end to the institution of segregation; government merely ratified this shift by codifying these changes into law.

(Indeed, I would argue that the greatest obstacle to continued progress on civil rights and removing the last element of racism are those who now cling to rigidly maintaining these laws and remedies as thought nothing has changed in the past 40-plus years, as though the same problems persist unchanged requiring the same solutions, perpetuating (and perhaps building their careers upon) racial divisions and a culture of victimhood that at this point are largely a product of their closed minds and rote actions.)

Obama appears to be an heir to this retrograde tradition, at least based upon his limited record, plus the public words and records of those he views as his mentors and of those who have sponsored him and enabled his rise to his present position.

----------------------------------

And thus, building on this example, I would urge you to question your instinct to look to "government" as the agent of change or the "guaranteer" of rights - rather, put more faith in individuals and their voluntary associations and private initiatives to be the engine that will move this country forward.

And Rightly So!

Since hillorphan reposted her comment as this blog, I've copied my response there likewise.

And Rightly So!

The blog title is To Chris

It would probably be better to continue any comment thread there.

And Rightly So!

was that he appeared to be taken by surprise that such a case was pending . . . I mean, did it occur to him in advance that if the case went for the terrorists, it would give him an excellent opportunity to separate himself from the left wing and demonstrate some commitment to protecting Americans?

Apparently not . . .

I wonder if he knows that there's a second amendment case pending -- to be decided within the next week or so -- and that whatever the outcome he will be called upon to give an opinion?

Is he aware that there's a death penalty case pending that raises the question whether the state can execute someone for the non-homicide rape of a child?

BRASSBAND77

I can tell you that at least one average swing voter that I know, does not. When I pointed out that the Constitution does not protect foreign nationals unless they are on US soil, that person said the following:

"Yeah but that is just legal detail nonsense, you have to look at the humanity of it."

That comment came from an ivy league grad who is not "stupid".

That is what we're up against, and he is a swing voter who is up for grabs by either candidate.

and supported a McCain 2000 run, they sure are. These are the people McCain needs to win, they are independents.

You're saying that NJ is not worth pursuing?

I think it a long shot but this type of guy is common as an independent in other states that are much closer to being won by McCain.

I just think that kind of attitude of indifference and snarkyness towards ivy leaguers is going to lose the election. If a voter is on the fence, ivy league or not, we need to make a full effort to win them over.

New Jersey, with its population spread over multiple expensive media markets, is a high risk investment. We keep getting told it's close, it's close, we could win... and we never do.

Too many New Jersey voters are just too comfortable with corrupt, wicked Democrats for the national party to be smart to spend money trying to sway them.

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The second portion of your description of the fellow.

As to the humanity, just say fine we will kill them on the battlefield. They aren't required to be taken prisoner.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

And I agree, I told him as much.

He claims to have two issues, the environment and foreign policy. His big request on the latter is to please not "screw it up"...

And yet Obama is still a choice?

Hmmm... how interesting. In every instance, your ideas about how Obama could have been different seems to match up with your political ideas. You would have seen him as "new" and "different" if he had embraced your ideas. Perhaps all Democrats could take this as a lesson: if they want to seem "different" they should just whole-heartedly embrace the Republicans' agenda!

...but not by much. Your inherent cynicism seems to be holding back your art.

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!

Ha, you call that trolling? Simply disagreeing? Sorry to break it to ya sweetheart but that ain't trolling. Get it right.

I know it's hard for Republicans to understand all these newfangled internet terms, seeing as you're all trying to conform to the stodgy old white man stereotype. After all, your Führer is technologically illiterate (that must be some delicious irony for a Republican blog to swallow).

(that was trolling)

Bye.

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!

Perhaps you didn't actually read the article. I know it might be too long for an Obama supporter, so here his conclusion that sums it all up for you:

What is new about Obama, however, is the length to which he has gone to convince voters that his greasy fast food served on fine china is really nouveau cuisine. It's not. If Obama doesn't start to come up with some genuinely new positions and fresh ideas, he will lose in November, and become just another bitter liberal former nominee.

Obama is just a used car salesmen trying to sell us a 1978 Cartermobile and calling it new.

Mark didn't say that he had to adopt Republican policies. He was using this week (this just being the latest in a long line just like them) as an example of how Obama offering the same think the left always has, and nothing new.

Have you added to the population of the McCain 2008 minicity yet today?

I drive a hydrogen powered car - C8H18 to be exact.

...and if he's outdoing y'all in that realm, then, whatever... That isn't something I care too much about.

And how dare you demean good folks like used car salesmen.

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Obama has never met a lie he didn't like, so yeah, he outshines all of us in that department.

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Daniel 2:20 And he [God] changeth the times and seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding.

all, but live in your dreamworld Addison...out here in the real world VA and WV and OH and FL and KY etc. we all will make sure Obama does not get the WH....if you think that he can win the WH with college students, elites and African-Americans....you are not adding up the electorate very well....those groups do not make up the MAJORITY.....this is not a caucus this is a REAL election.

He will lose and we will all be called racists and we will say "whatever" and go on with our lives and you and yours will be crying and saying "the election was stolen"...heh.

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

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Daniel 2:20 And he [God] changeth the times and seasons: he removeth kings, and setteth up kings: he giveth wisdom unto the wise, and knowledge to them that know understanding.

...well.

Look, if that's your viewpoint there's nothing I can do to help you. There are ways McCain can win. But it's not the denial that Obama can win VA, and things like that. You're burying your head in the sand here. I'm a Virginia boy myself, and Virginia is potentially gonna go Obama. Virginia is, actually, a Democratic state, and it's up to McCain to win it.

It doesn't behoove anyone on RedState.com to fling themselves into the outer-orbits of reality.

Pretending that Obama isn't a force to be reckoned with, and merely a joke, is the worst mistake you guys can make. How many state will the GOP lose before they understand that?

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not BLUE which by the way is why the legislature is RED but the smart people of VA will vote for a blue Governer to keep a balance and I can guarantee you VA will not be going to Obama with or without Webb.

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

I also live in VA, and would like to know how in the world you define this entire state as blue?

...and that's good enough for me, right now.

I'm no big fish as far as influence goes, so my opinion is only as good as people think it is. If you think my opinion matters, keep responding, though.

The entire state isn't "blue." But VA is a state that the GOP has to win, nevertheless.

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I know you like to say mess a lot rather than address facts and then pass it off as profound analysis. So, a present.

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

...VA is a swing state. Don't try to marginalize that and still seem objective.

What's so weird to me about the debate going on here is that it's all about how Obama is going to fail and not how McCain will succeed, without a debate about how that will happen.

VA will be Obama territory until McCain gets on his game and tries to win it. He hasn't done it yet.

In other words, as much as I respect you, your gut isn't superseding mine as far as how I see the political future.

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votes. b) Obama lawyers sue for recount is state(s) he loses by the least votes. c) Obama loses court case and cries racism. d) Obama wins nobel peace prize for civil disobedience protesting high piano lessons fees in Hyde Park.

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/va/virginia_mccai...

In this RCP average Obama after his "bump" is 0.5 over McCain and according to you McCain isn't doing anything...all the slavish devotion will wear off like bad drugs and this will turn and that is from my feet on the ground and local papers and blogs not just my "gut"...

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

about blue state VA and McCain must winning and infer that Obama will win and you get this information from your gut?

Let me tell you what that tells me...you are nauseated by the fact that Obama doesn't stand a snowballs chance in hell of winning southern states and it is tearing your guts up....take some pepto bismal it will go away....and when you have something other than your gut please come back and share!

So do you even volunteer on the local level or go see your local congressmen or senators...do you participate in anyway other than blogging?

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

thousands of political opponents and sponsoring suicide bombers is NOT MESS.

Free Iraq post 3 free elections with diverse military and US aid defeating al qaeda, shia militias and Iranian backed militias is MESS.

see if that helps

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

...you've been around long enough to know this isn't true. Iraq is a mess. That's true. That doesn't mean it can't be fixed, or that I don't want it fixed. I do.

Please don't misrepresent me. It doesn't do either of of us well. I would happily see Obama lose if the people of Iraq were to experience a stable society.

You know better Gamecock, and I'm really unhappy that you portray my motives so falsely.

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of choice among pseudo intellectuals.

messes:

dog sh*t
war
mass slaughter by dictators (also called peace by liberals)

mush:

dog sh*t
the contents of liberal's minds
what tyrannical dictators give peasants to eat

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

...if you think a "mess" as something beyond solving I don't know what to make of you. Iraq is a mess. Russia is a mess. Turkmenistan is a mess. Etc. Most of what we have to deal with is a mess. Most of politics is a mess. This can't be a surprise. Messes are the nature of the American politic itself.

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Addison has no interest in debate. Follow link in his sig to clever site adoring Gramsci, Adorno and Reich.

What is "Critical Theory"?

"The Frankfort School would patent the familiar "Critical Theory" which was accurately defined by a student as the "essentially destructive criticism of all the main elements of Western culture, including Christianity, capitalism, authority, the family, patriarchy, hierarchy, morality, tradition, sexual restraint, loyalty, patriotism, nationalism, heredity, ethnocentrism, convention, and conservatism."

Under Critical Theory, anything emanating from the west is to be libeled and attacked over and over again while at the same time, anything emerging from a "progressive" country or group is to be applauded including the murder of over 100 million people. All blame for societal and economic ills are to be shifted to the west.

The saturating drumbeat of Critical Theory would lead to "Cultural Pessimism" which is when a person grows to loathe the society, which nurtured him and provided him unprecedented levels of success. This describes the attitude of so many leftists living in comfort and safety yet viewing America, the society that made their lifestyle possible, with hatred and contempt. I am amazed by the degree in which both Critical Theory and Cultural Pessimism has been internalized by all of us."

http://www.enterstageright.com/archive/articles/0102/0102frankfortschool...

Another disinterested net surfer seeking information at R.S. to form rational decision is B.S. He is here only to disrupt and agitate.

...thank goodness for academia, otherwise I would've never known that about myself. Thanks!

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the Obama campaign taking a jab at him. Love the Fred!

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/06/22/hot-air-exclusive-fred-thompson-on...

The free exchange of ideas inevitably yields both heat and light.

1. If the election is about Obama, McCain will win.

2. If the election is about McCain, McCain will win.

3. If the election is about Bush/Cheney, Obama will win.

Oh by the way....it's Gandhi...not Ghandi.
And I'm an Ivy grad...not totally dumb!

...what can I do when you're so right?

It's Gandhi, not Ghandi.

I blame anything but my own idiocy. My phonetic learning told me otherwise, told me it was Ghandi. Transliteration is important, but it can only go so far...

I apologize for debasing the spelling of RedState.com.

Ohbahmah is still my choice for president, btw.

[septembergurl should be congratulated for her correction]

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...I hope the new RedState version prevents people looking like idiots by posting to the general thread versus a specific comment.

New: (-1.50, -5.33)

It certainly explains why you chose to elevate the trivial and ignore the actual points.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

intellectual lighweight who believes himself to be as his master is trying to be "above the fray" when the reality of the situation is you are one of the peons who will find themselves asking "why" when McCain not only takes the 62 million who voted for President Bush in 04 but takes another 20 million more who see the man (I use that loosely) behind the mask that Obama is......

Enjoy your little moment it will be over before you know it....poof begone!

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

...if I'm "above the fray" I am concerned for our nation as a whole. I'm in the fray, definitely, but I try. I am not interested in anything but debate and the betterment of our society.

Any mistakes made are my own, and only credited to my own ignorance. But to go further than infer that I am not acting in good faith, or with some semblance of knowledge, is wrongheaded.

The difference between Ghandi and Gandhi, to me, seems rather small. Transliteration is a little thing compared to what matters.

New: (-1.50, -5.33)

own ignorance but to go further and there is no inference here it is the real deal....this is a Republican/Conservative site where we discuss at length a way forward for our candidates and we do not excuse our candidates for being "politicians"
...so in that regards you are indeed acting in bad faith.

The difference between Ghandi and Gandhi is indeed small but when someone holds themselves up to the implied arrogance of being better educated it will always be the little things that trip them up and that is when another member will say to themselves "that little snot" I am going to call him on it
....understand?

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

...held myself up as better educated? Where? And where have I ever said such a thing matters in this forum? It doesn't. You're just distracting. I don't blame you. But that's what you're doing, a phonetic misplacement of an "h" as a reason for derailing a conversation is a sad, sad reason for not approaching a topic in good faith.

New: (-1.50, -5.33)

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

...it's so much better than I ever could've done.

New: (-1.50, -5.33)

..again, I hope that the new version of RedState will do a better job of preventing idiotic mistakes.

C'mon admin, help us help ourselves!

New: (-1.50, -5.33)


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

...certainly I am speaking to the designer of the new beta version of RedState.

This "reply to" problem has been extant a little too long for posters of all political persuasions.

And, hey, self-interestedly, I don't like looking stupid for potentially preventable reasons.

New: (-1.50, -5.33)

Of course I have no idea how you would expect the designer of the new site to prevent users from making errors.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

except when I make a mental error....otherwise I hit reply to and bang I am replying to you....it isn't complicated...really it's not...will you be voting on an electronic machine? I only ask because you might end up voting for McCain....and I want you to be able to live with yourself.

Freedom of Religion NOT Freedom from Religion

not?

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

That is, the very last post on the page...

If you're not especially careful, you'll hit the blog "reply to" rather than the comment "reply to", and you can think you're replying to the comment when you're actually starting a new thread.

So I do feel sympathy with Addison for his "reply to" problems, but the rest of his difficulties is from his continuing to dig when he's in a hole of his own making.

And Rightly So!

...when people go with my own self-deprecation as a chance for insulting me. I called myself out on my own idiocy already! I'm way ahead of the curve here.

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I like you, you're silly.


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777

smile

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

Gamecock, you know me, you know how I'm not nuts, and I don't understand what you're doing here.

New: (-1.50, -5.33)

your reply above where you basically described the condition of all of mankind (since Eve bit the apple] as a "mess." Here:

http://www.redstate.com/blogs/gamecock/2008/jun/22/cockstradamus_u_s_wil...

you dismissed Iraq as an irredeemable "mess", thus, rendering the word "mess' as meaningless, while at the same time relying upon the characterization as dis-positive in some way.

That kind of il-logic is a mess.

I clean up messes non sequiturs on Redstate, esp those that dishonor the great achievements of our armed forces and the courageous sacrifices or our allies, esp the Iraqi people.

The mess was what existed on Sept 10 that made a mess in NYC on 911.

No messes since 911 as our armed forces kill mess makers abroad and President Bush thwarts them at home, no thanks to the biggest messes in the USA, democrats esp incl Obama.

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

...though it can get tough sometimes to follow the thread. That means I was partially defending you (specifically, regarding the "Reply to" matter).

Are you sure you meant to reply to me in this fashion, cause it doesn't seem to follow...

And Rightly So!

Huh? by bs

What, the Smartest Man in The Room needs help?


The Unofficial RedState FAQ
“You are not only responsible for what you say, but also for what you do not say. ” - Martin Luther

Far greater are those that come from not knowing when to stop replying.

:::Whistling:::


"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777


The Unofficial RedState FAQ
“You are not only responsible for what you say, but also for what you do not say. ” - Martin Luther

A few similarities between the two, like getting hung-up on minutiae, but BrooksRob was definitely coming from a different personal space than Addison is. For one, I recall that BrooksRob came from NYC and liked to boast about having a girlfriend - and gravitated towards arguing on sexual behavior threads.

And Rightly So!

That'll help some. Don't expect Nanny RedState,though. I know lefties prefer to have personal responsibilities taken over by government, but the most you'll get here is a "No Trolls Left Behind" FAQ.

The current administration has opened doors few could have imagined.

W. hasn't made the job look easy but he has left the impression that almost anyone could do it.

At the moment, voters are just acknowledging anger and resentment. McCain needs to accept that and move the debate to his policies.

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

if we reimagine those outcomes. If dissatisfaction with Reagan had been great enough to open the door for Mondale and then Dukakis in his run against Bush Sr.

But the situation is quite reversed at present and W. isn't leaving McCain to ride a wave of his popularity as Reagan did for Bush Sr.

However, if your point is absurdity I can see the wisdom. Desperate times.

the door is open for a far left candidate, esp as far left with as many open associations with radical terrorists and racisists to be elected president. We won't know until after the Obama lawsuits after McCain is elected!

I would say that the number of votes Kerry got gives me pause.

But the problem with this Bush made this possible meme is that we seem to usually win the presidency but never get the fact that we are a center right nation and that modern day liberalism is dsicredited due to the libs domination of the news on all the days other than election days.

Mike DeVine’s Charlotte Observer columns
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race." - The Chief Justice

I'm down with absurdity.

Proudly supporting John S. McCain for President (McCain/Romney?)

You have to love this Obama is caught between Moveon.org and everyone else. Please fillbuster the FISA bill Sen. Obama. This would be the greatest thing to happen to the Republican Party in a long time. If he doesn't the left will probably take him apart. You have to love liberals they always find a way to lose.

 
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