Did we just win the immigration fight?
Maybe 40 isn't such a large number after all
By krempasky Posted in Immigration — Comments (129) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
It sure seems like enough previous "yes" votes on cloture have switched to the side of the angels. Roll call below the fold as soon as it's final. And a special 'hats off' to Senator Brownback - an early supporter of cloture that did the right thing before the vote ended. It's hard to overstate the enormous amount of pressure he must be under.
FINAL ROLL CALL: 46-53
UPDATE: By the way, the Politico reported about the potential "divorce" between House GOP and the White House. After this kick in the junk, I'd say the White House has lost the mistress, too.
UPDATE by Erick: Heros include Jim DeMint and Jeff Sessions for leading the fight against this bill. Several folks point out that David Vitter should be included in this too.
Villains have to include John McCain and Lindsey Graham for their tag team efforts in South Carolina to personally smear Jim DeMint. They can deny it, but lots of us know what happened and shame on them.
Harry Reid, btw, promises to bring this bill back.
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Did we just win the immigration fight? 129 Comments (0 topical, 129 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »
I'd like to see someone list the provisions this bill would have subjected us to, that none of the Senators got the chance to actually read. The whole process was a sham and it's important to keep holding the culprits' feet to the fire for trying to pull it off.
They seem to think that people are going to change their minds when the only things that change are the dirty tactics used.
To those in the senate, from the American people. We don't like it and will not like in a few months either. Get a clue. When something polls at 80% negative, you have everyone across the board against it, R's, D's and I's.
Can the rest of the country secede from inside the beltway?
Now that we've defeated the Shamnesty Bill we must fax and email them while the issue is HOT!
Tell them we must secure our borders and enforce our laws right now, TODAY! Use the momentum we have built.
OR shall we wait another 21 years and 20+ Million more illegal aliens for another wrongheaded legislation to be shoved down our throats from a closed door "compromise"?
We are paying out over $340 BILLION per year right now for the illegal aliens we have, what will we be paying a year from now, ten years from now?
Strike while the iron is hot folks, let them know we mean business!
Use Numbers USA and GOP USA to write them today!
Go Get'em!
** Numbers USA FREE Fax and Email!**
( Senators AND the President )
http://www.numbersusa.com/actionbuffet
GOP USA
http://capwiz.com/gopusa/home/
"After two years in Washington, I often long for the realism and the sincerity of Hollywood."
need to resign their leadership positions for their role in this fiasco.
When Reid brings it up again, lets have people running the GOP cause who reflect the actual positions of the caucus members.
And no, McConnell's vote here does not absolve him for what he has done. He only voted the way he did when he saw which way the wind was blowing.
Sessions for Minority Leader.
No need to bring out the talk of trying to oust them from office. Let's just work on fixing the leadership.
Run like Reagan!
While I am happy with today's vote, I hate to admit it but Reid probably is as well. McConnell never should have agreed to the "Clay Pigeon" procedure. He needs gently to step aside for DeMint, Sessions, or Coburn.
I like Reid as Senate Majority leader and want him to keep his job through the 2008 election. Republicans cannot, again I say, CANNOT, buy the kind of advertising we get get from Harry Reid. He and Pelosi are leading their party into Pit of Despair.
OH YES WE DO HAVE TO OUST THEM FROM OFFICE (ANY & ALL OF THEM-TOP TO BOTTOM) IF THEY WON'T LISTEN TO THEIR CONSTITUENTS! They are there to be a voice for their people at home...and McConnell is NOT that...he is up for re-election in 08 and needs to be sent home to private life! He's been in Washington too long-thinks he is above listening to his people back home!
What Part of ILLEGAL ALIEN Don't You Get?
McConnell may not be the best leader, but he's a good senator in general.
Romney or Fred.
Jeff Sessions showed what a real Minority Leader ought to look like. Leadership ability like that, its been rare on Capitol Hill for the last 6-7 years.
My personal 'thanks a million' to Sen. Sessions, DeMint and Vitter, who are my adopted Senators!
Well done, Senators DeMint and Sessions. Thank you.
Someone posted on RedState a couple days ago that a government that can't get you your passport in three months time, certaintly can't process X million Z-visas, etc. That was a great analogy, overflowing with common sense.
He worked great with Sessions and DeMint. He's a future star in the party.
Some others weren't as visible, but were helpful too, such as my two TX senators.
LOL, guys you make me laugh ! I have a great time, well, hopefully you'll not be crying one day with this kind of attitude. LOL,
:-)
LETS NOT FORGET TANCREDO...who is also running for President in 2008-he is the ONLY ONE dedicated to listening to the American Citizen/Taxpayer on the Immigration Issue!
What Part of ILLEGAL ALIEN Don't You Get?
Or a silver bullet...
But actually my favorite comparison would be that exposure to sunlight will kill a vampire. That's exactly what killed this bill, sunlight. Despite the efforts of the White House, the leadership of the Democratic Party and certain senior members of the US Senate to birth this thing in a cave, and grow it in the closet we were able to expose it to the light of day.
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.
Make no mistake about it, the American people turned the tide on this fiasco. This morning the Senate switchboard was so overloaded with calls that it shut down! A great victory and many of the people here in RedState need to be congratulated for their great efforts!
I agree. While there are heroes like Sesssions it was the overwhelming reponse by American citizens that defeated this bill. This bill would have passed without large public activism.
Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you. Washington Elected Elite
I want to say good job to my hometown Senator, Jeff Sessions for being a major critic of the bill. Thanks for representing Mobile well.
The unmistakable outbreaks of zeal which occur all around me show that you are earnest men
But is there a roll call list anywhere that I'm missing?
Pick the first entry in the first column. I'm not sure if posting that link works, as the links get a little funny.
http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/vote_menu_110_1.ht...
I told my husband that I have invested so much energy into this defeat and I am just so relieved that the Senators who voted no had the courage to uphold what the American public wanted by 80%. I also will let Webb know that he can count on me for financial help when he runs, whether I would vote for him is another thing.
1. Get military funding
2. Shut down the Senate for anything else unless the Dems start playing ball on appellate judicial nominations
Being an ordinary member of the Republican Senate caucus. Because he can no longer be Minority Leader after the way he treated his fellow GOP Senators.
The bill was defeated. We needed only four Democrat votes to do it. If people want to get angry, get angry with the members of the GOP caucus who voted for cloture. Our side went from 35 to 53 in two days. McConnell handled it well. Those who felt that they needed cover got it, and the bill is effectively dead. I'm not taking anything away from those who led the fight against the bill. They deserve a lot of credit. Now, though, the legislation has failed. Every Republican in any trouble in 2008, save Hagel, voted against cloture. Our side won by thirteen votes. The grassroots conservative movement showed its strenght. This reengaged and energized many conservatives who had been disenchanted with the political process and placed the blame for the bill and its failure squarely on Harry Reid. How could we have asked for more?
McConnell teamed up with Reid to try to force this thing through, steamrolling the members of his own caucus in the process.
If the bill comes up once more I don't want this man being the nominal Minority Leader again, while shafting the minority.
This is real life. There ought to be consequences for doing bad things, even for the privileged members of the Senate.
Actions have consequences.
McConnell must face up to his, give up his leadership post (along with Lott), and then vote against such nonsense so that he can win re-election in Kentucky as a senator. If he doesn't do the last, he can recall, again, that actions have consequences.
Hagel was in the back pocket of the meat packing industry which loves cheap immigrant labor.
These plants pay about 12 bucks per hour, instead of 16-18 bucks per hour, because they
have imported Mexicans.
Nelson, the Democrat, cares about the views of the majority of Nebraskans. He is usually more conservative than Hagel, the Repulican.
Mitch has one more job, and it won't be pleasant. He, Senator Demint and Senator Coburn need to pay a scoail call to President Bush. They need to inform him in no uncertain terms, that he no longer sets the domestic agenda for the Republican Party. They will support him on Iraq, but he either now supports them on the social and economic agenda, or he only speaks for himself.
I hate to have to fire a President I personally voted for twice, but this is where things have gone.
"I have nothing but contempt for Representatives who only represent themselves." - H. Roe Bartle
He could start to enforce the laws, fire Chertoff, and begin to build the fence and so forth, and not have as unpleasant a ride to the retirement party.
Mitch McConnell doesn't have the GUTS to confront Bush or anyone else! I am sorry to say that I voted for Bush twice...thought he was actually a decent person but he has since proven himself to be a pig-headed stubborn donkey...He apparently thinks himself above the say of the American public...hopefully he will now see he is NOT!
What Part of ILLEGAL ALIEN Don't You Get?
Blam.
I don't have time to explain all of these, but I trust they are self-explanatory. Complaints may be addressed to the contact form.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
This is clearly a large victory, because it was wrought by forces who have little-to-no voice in DC. It's probably a little vain to say this is a "first". It's probably a "second", the withdrawal of Harriet Miers being the "first".
This is so much bigger. The Miers nomination was grotesquely flawed, and pitted the White House against grassroots conservatives and talk radio -- with Dems and the press laughing it up on the sidelines.
This Amnesty Bill (also grotesquely flawed) pitted a formidable array of proponents -- a fiercely entrenched White House, GOP Senate leadership, deal-making political cowards on the GOP side, old-style Rockefeller Republicans, Big Business, the National Partisan Media, the internationalist crowd, UN lovers, and terrorist states and appeasers everywhere.
On our side -- a number of heroic conservative Senators and Representatives on the Hill, talk radio, the conservative side of the internet/blogworld, and.......millions of Americans.
We won - albeit only because the Senate requires 60%. But the taste of victory develops an appetite for more victory. We know we can be heard.
There is another matter. GOP Senators (and I'd guess House people also),can see that a cleansing movement is underway. The poll numbers for McCain and Gramnesty are dramatically -- dramatically down. Primary opponents -- good, conservative ones -- can mount popular caampaigns, since primaries are 7-10 months out.
So, it ain't Appomattox Courthouse. But it might be Gettysburg.
It's war -- so when can we start shooting back at the enemy Democrats?
"There is another matter. GOP Senators (and I'd guess House people also),can see that a cleansing movement is underway. The poll numbers for McCain and Gramnesty are dramatically -- dramatically down. Primary opponents -- good, conservative ones -- can mount popular caampaigns, since primaries are 7-10 months out."
Again, well said. The time for a good cleaning is now. I welcome the day principle returns to the Republican party.
And as for me, I am now freed of the burden of defending George W Bush.
this was a formidable team to go up against.
I am reminded of Rush Limbaugh's great piece of insight during the hottest part of the Harriet Miers fight. The Howard Fineman's of the world were joyously reporting a "Republican Crack-up". Rush got it right - it was the opposite - a "Conservative Crackdown".
Conservatives do well when fighting tooth and nail for principled positions. This was one of those times.
Now, if President Bush could put some of that passion reserve into fighting for, and demanding, support of the Iraq surge, then we would REALLY have won something important.
I need to go make some money this weekend so I can afford it.
I'm in NH. Gregg voted for this, Sununu against.
Sununu, $100 coming. Gregg, a peso.
Gregg reversed his vote, today, but he only did that after seeing where this was headed. I sent him an email yesterday telling him that he has received my last vote.
First, we need to all thank Senator Tester for this amendment.
Second, Senator Kyl is also a member of the Senate Republican leadership who supports amnesty and needs to be kicked out of the leadership.
He figured the Dems could get something horrible through, so he wanted to make the best of it. He is certainly not one of the Graham or Specter types who seemed more interested in the amnesty side. He had a pretty thankless job, and he gets much of the criticism for the crappy process here since McConnell disappeared from view the entire time.
Time to encourage all those same Senators you've been calling and writing to get after the security angle. Let's see some fence construction and serious improvement in individual and corporate enforcement. Now is the time for real leaders to emerge as the American public is engaged like never before.
Sessions or DeMint for leadership... yes.
If the Bush Administration will continue to do what it did immediately before this vote regarding workplace enforcement, build the authorized fence and enforce other laws on the book, it can repair some of the massive damage it inflicted on the GOP.
On the bright side, if we get a credible enforcement-first nominee and either Hillary or Obama are the Dem nominees, this election can be a walk after all.
Push for border security and interior enforcement. Dems who still refuse to provide security SIX YEARS AFTER 9/11 need to be put on the record. If they still refuse to secure the border, you can absolutely beat them over the head with that in '08.
There's no downside for him - every time Reid brings this bill up, he splits the Republican caucus, and divorces the Republican base from the Washington establishment.
It is amazing how colossally stupid bringing this bill up was.
This could very well be the thing that dooms all GOP chances in 2008. I can't believe how stupid this was...
It is not Harry Reid, liberals, Democrats or any other group you may want to mention that is splitting the Republican base from the Washington establishment. Their actions only expose what already exists.
As a member of the Republican base, I would like to paraphrase
a statement made by R. Reagan which applies.
" I didn't leave the Washington Establishment, The Washington Establishment left me. "
I don't know what 2008 may bring for the Republican party, but
unless it reconnects to its base in a meaningful way, the future of it is doubtful anyway.
I defended Lott and criticized the effort to block him from leadership. Obviously, I overestimated his abilities to shepherd us back to a majority.
Between immigration and now the "fairness doctrine" he needs to resign and let someone else show him how to lead. He can return to being a "back bencher" for as long as his state wants him.
"Dulce et decorum est pro patria mori"
Contributor to The Minority Report
As I posted here, all of our calls & emails turned the tide. Once again, We The People triumphed. Give yourselves all a big pat on the back!!! What's especially satisfying is the fact that Kennedy, Reid & La Raza couldn't even reach a majority. SWEET!!!
What I have never understood is why would the President want to hand a POLITICAL VICTORY to the liberals on a silver platter?!!
If this had passed- EVERY liberal would be claiming how great the Senate is, how effective they are. "Look what we have accomplished!!"
Not to mention getting 80% of the vote of 12 million illegals once they are granted citizenship! Isn't the President the leader of our party?!!
And stick a fork in McCain- he will be in single digits from now on in just about every poll. We need a primary challenge to Goober Graham in SC as well.
United States Air Force
http://airforcepundit.blogspot.com
Can we try to spend at least as much time on this thread discussing potential opponents to Democrats from red states who voted for this as we do discussing opponents to Republicans who voted for this? I mean, even assuming that there isn't any measurable difference betwenn Rs and Ds who vote for this (demonstrably false, as yesterday's card check vote demonstrated), that means that Rs and Ds deserve equal time, right?
We need to get anti-amnesty Republicans into office in those states to oppose the Dems who voted for cloture today.
Since there is no discussion on this thread of opponents to Republicans who voted for this, I'm not sure what you are actually asking for. But I see nothing wrong with what you say in principal.
The list of RedState D's who voted for this -
Nelson (D-FL)
Reid (D-NV)
Conrad (D-ND)
Lincoln (D-AR)
Salazar (D-CO)
I don't believe any of these are up in 2008 though.
That is not exactly "discussion" of primary challengers, which would be a lot more meaningful than generic calls for primary opponents.
But if you look at the roll call you will see that the red state senators supporting this bill were mostly Republicans.
Given your position on this issue I don't expect you to agree, but a primary challenge to Graham is an excellent idea. The GOP nominee in SC will be the presumptive winner in the general.
lincolnmonroe
I think the heat should stay on these poor excuses for Americans. The lies and deceit associated with this bill, from the President down to the Senate was unbelievable!
The politicos in Mexico looking at this shameful event were probably exclaiming, "Aayee! Que bueno! The Gringos are the same as us! The Peasants are too stupid to be told the truth"!
If we can pull it off not a damn one of these people that voted for this bill, republican or democrat should be re-elected.
Blam.
Time to reel it in folks. There have been several warnings to this effect.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
Even he is going to realize that bringing something up for repeated rejections isn't going to help Democrats.
With immigration off the agenda, Democrats in both houses have a real problem. They need to accomplish something to justify their majority, but the only way to do so is by giving something to Bush.
Like the withdrawal of Harriet Miers nomination, the biggest winner of Bush's defeat on immigration likely is going to be Bush.
Politics is strange.
of principled conservatives, like DeMint, Vitter, Sessions, Cornyn et al gives me hope for the Republican party.
Frank Katz
Apart from its appalling content, this vote represents a repudiation of the tactics used by supporters that assaulted the very foundations of the institution of the Senate. There is damage from having allowed this bill to proceed this far, but at least the struture still stands.
Bravo to those Senators who stood up not only against an execrable bill but also for the Senate itself!
Most of you don't realize what has been done. The debate was killed, we are going to lock ourselves here with 12 million illegal immigrants after securing our border. And it's going to be a new President's job to reopen the issue. It will never go away. Don't be blind. This issue requires debate and presenting amendments. As I said this is a sad, sad day. Most of the wise men realize that, some of them are temporarily blinded by a "victory " that offers no solution.
SAD DAY !
Hopefully now we can get the border fence funded and built and we can get some meaningful legislation passed that will make a difference. Things like cutting off all federal funds to jurisdictions that declare themselves "sanctuaries" for illegal aliens, and getting meaningful ID's and processes to insure that businesses can effectively check their legal status for work.
We need a hundred more "sad days" just like this.
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.
I doubt that you have acquired any idea what "most" of us realize or not. A new President can secure the border and enforce the current laws against employers, and over time the illegal problem will take care of itself. At minimum, it won't get any worse and the Democrats won't have access to millions of new peon voters.
In Vino Veritas
Nobody would get any voters from the legalization of illegal immigrants. Z-visa or a permanent residency does not grant the right to vote ! Go visit USCIS website to learn immigration law and privileges of naturalization.
How is citizenship even checked prior to voting? I can show up with a utility bill and vote.
Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you. Washington Elected Elite
That would be a felony. Nobody can target a group of illegals as a potential voters expecting them to vote and go to jail for it.
They wouldn't give a crap anyway. They are here to pick up peaches and cut our lawns, aren't they ?
must be why nobody ever does it. Fundamentally, NOTHING is illegal if the laws aren't enforced and on this subject, they are not enforced at all in the Blue places and not nearly enough in most of the Red places.
In Vino Veritas
Are you that naive? LOL. Umm isn't breaking into our country also illegal? If nobody gives a crap about that they don't care about policing voter fraud. I'd like to see one instance of a voter getting nailed for being an illegal when they presented a drivers licence or a utility bill.
I bet there is no check for felons voting either. Sure it is against the law but the law is worthless without ENFORCEMENT.
Ask not what you can do for your country, ask what your country can do for you. Washington Elected Elite
If it is a felony, hundreds of thousands are being committed in CA. It is easy to defeat the county registrar, who can handle the issue of residency, but not citizenship. Paperwork is always subject to falsification. I don't think most persons realize how many illegal immigrants get legal status after arriving here. However, the problem is not with the illegals themselves, but their kids who are automatic citizens. Some of these kids will be reaching voting age soon.
This article proves It
Like chess, if you can't see the last move, you're not smart enough to make the first move. Illegals already vote heavily in the really Blue places. As soon as some sort of legal status is conferred, many of those places will confer legal voting rights in state and local elections, then it is only a matter of time and Democrat control at the federal level before the now-legal illegals are voters safe from annoying USDOJ investigations into voter fraud.
And BTW, you don't have a clue what I know about immigration law.
In Vino Veritas
That's what I get for talking on the phone and typing at the same time!
Wife giving the almost hourly update from ANC, where I became a step-grandfather last night a little after midnight ADT - healty boy named Gavin.
In Vino Veritas
Something to celebrate. May we do what needs to be done to ensure his ability to pursue life, liberty, and happiness.
I hope everyone is doing well
" in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years."
Abe Lincoln
Everyone is doing well, though you'd have though it was my wife having her first baby from the hysteria level in the last few days. I was waaaay happy to put her on the plane to ANC and get this thing DONE! I'm of the school that believes that a man's role in childbirth is writing the check and thanking the doc, but that didn't stop her from the hourly updates about how many centimeters dialation and all that stuff.
In Vino Veritas
can go away with some very simple acts. One-enforce the current
laws. Two- Make amendments if necessary to enforce the current laws. This bill was totally unnecessary. Those people who are not here legally are illegal immigrants. Follow the law on what to do with them. No other country just allows people to walk in and stay. Why are we doing it?
The immediate result of this defeat is going to be an incredible outpouring of support for the reinstatement of the fairness doctrine, unless GWB and the people in his Administration (and Trent Lott) have enough grace to recognize that it was a piece of legislation that should rightly have been defeated.
So here's the news: everyone in this room right now had better be willing to stand up legally and rhetorically for people in Talk Radio and elsewhere *right now* because in the aftermath of this letdown, my impression is that the President might be retributive and the Democrats are *certainly going to be* retributive.
That means that Rush Limbaugh, Howie Carr, et. al., now officially have targets painted on their backs.
Have always been targets now it ust happens that the cannons are going to be turned on them. The Bills defeat is the begining of the next war possibly more fundimental than that for amnisty, the battle for our Freedom of Speech and capitalism itself. And here is where we can kill Mrs. Bill Clintons chances for winning in 08. This is something she can't resist commenting on, the "Vast Right Wing Conspiricy".
What we are going to need is a strong person that can articulate what the Dems and Billery are trying to do. Hmmmm now who do I know that can do that..... *CoughFredThompsonCough*.
and talk radio fits the bill. Rush, Sean, Howie, Laura and the others can take care of themselves, though, with help from the blogosphere. Unfortunately, we will have people like Trent Lott, McCain, Hagel and others taking it out on talk radio. More than ever, we need to bring so much pressure to bear on these Republicans that they will be spending their time looking in the rear view mirror for any approaching primary challengers, rather than trying to stick it to the base again. It was us, the base, who did the job in getting this bill defeated, not those turncoat Republican senators.
And we should keep up the pressure to prevent Reid from resurrecting this bill again, by telling the Senate to stop playing games with the American people and get on with the rest of the country's business.
And his opinion is that it won't just be the Dems that are screeching for reinstatement of the Fairness Doctrine - it'll be some of the more retribution-minded Republicans as well.
You know, had Senator Lott only retired a few years back, we might not have had all these problems...
Run like Reagan!
The only people with the cred to propose a bipartisan immigrationreform are the brave senatiors from both parties who voted NO today. Sessions...Devinter....Dorgan and a few others. Let's not de-mob just yet.
still a long way to go, but you should be proud of your efforts today !
With this kind of politics that prohibits debating of an important issue, the day when Demint or Sessions will get any significant power in this country the USA will turn into a dictatorship country. What I'm saying is that debating and talking about important issues is not a bad thing ! Some solution will have to emerge sooner or later. I didn't hear a single proposal from opposition of the bill that offered any suitable solution. Did you ?
about exactly who tried to stifle debate here. It wasn't the conservative and patriotic opposition. It was the "Grand Bagainers" who tried to shut down the opposition through unorthodox and virtually unprecedented procedural maneuvers, like the "clay pidgeon", the lack of normal committee hearings, and no formal cost analysis. This legislation was not only bad policy, it was a bad process.
As for your complaint that no one offered their own proposal to fix the problem, you obviously have not read the many such proposals that have been offered on this very site.
Frank Katz
"I didn't hear a single proposal from opposition of the bill that offered any suitable solution. Did you ?"
1) Build the fence
2) Enforce existing law
Let's start there, shall we?
John,
Now that the bill's gone down and you've got some time, go back and reread what people have been writing here for months. The search function will be very useful for that. You've been here only two days, but we've been discussing this much longer, including solutions. If you don't like them, that's a source of discussion, but please don't say that nobody is suggesting alternative solutions .
I respect that and I'll do my homework here. The ideas posted here might be great but why aren't they presented as a bill in the senate ?
If other ideas could float up as proposed amendments, that would be fine. But in this case the goal from the get-go was to squash virtually all debates and virtually all amendments.
who controls the agenda of the Senate, don't post on RS.
You might want to go back about a year and take note of the House immigration bill that passed last year. Something like that - enforcement first - might just get resurrected now.
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.
that the current Senate leadership would touch anything resembling "enforcement first" at this point, do you? Now maybe I'm imagining them as more vengeful than they truly are, but I'm sure they're aware that those who opposed the CIR bill are also the ones who are clamoring for enforcement-first, and I doubt that Graham, Lott, etc. would be eager to do them (us) any favors.
I was just responding to a stupid question upthread from braindead...
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.
As just one poster, your comments are welcome. I look upon this legislative action as part of a developing national consensus toward putting first things, first. No more obfuscation, please. We want the borders secured, period. Then, we can talk about all the other stuff.
McCain admitted in Iowa that it will take at least 18 months to get control of the border.
Since I have some experience. I hope that the next debate will be about counterfeit or tampered documents. The problem is that it takes a professional bureaucracy to truly verify documentation. Regular government agencies and businesses cannot do it.
I've outlined a comprehensive plan for dealing with illegal immigration at least twice.
Step one in ANY plan though has to be to secure the border. Presdient Clinton built the start of a fence, starting in San Diego and working east. Under President Bush though, what have we seen?
The burden is on HIM to DO HIS JOB.
Run like Reagan!
...nice attempt at "The Big Lie."
It never ceases to amaze me how some people's minds work -- including those who would argue that a vote against stopping the debate "prohibits debating of an important issue."
Your entire comment is a joke, right?
Not a joke I'm affraid...
Let's see what will happen in next two years.
Your next comment needs to responde to this. Thanks in advance.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
the day when Demint or Sessions will get any significant power in this country the USA will turn into a dictatorship country
I'm sure glad RS is cracking down on this sort of thing.
It so happens that I agree with you that the commenter in question was way out of line. I'll deal with him in a moment.
However, you have been warned time and time again (once as recently as this morning) about your constant passive-aggressive carping about how this site is run. You are, so far as I can tell, totally incapable of taking a hint and hitting either the contact button or the inbox of any of the moderators with your problems, despite several clear instructions not to do so.
The further problem is that whenever you are told to do this, you just slink away and never respond. So here's what's going to happen: I'm turning your account off. If you want to hit the contact button or the email inbox of one of the moderators and indicate to them that you clearly understand that you will cut this passive-aggressive BS out, and in the future lodge complaints through the proper channels, then I don't mind it if you come back, because (believe it or not) I think you're a valuable contributor here, even though we're often on opposite sides of things. Absent that, you can stay gone forever.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
the day when Demint or Sessions will get any significant power in this country the USA will turn into a dictatorship country.
I'm spending my lunch hour cleaning up comments in a victory thread and this displeases me. Yours was way out of line. Please explain why you shouldn't share the fate "Que bueno! Look at the stupid gringos!" guy.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
Maybe because when I see those two speak to the public it makes me sick and worried.
O.K. I'm happy now.
I can only imagine that getting banned from RedState was your goal all along. I trust that you are now happy indeed.
Blam.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
John Thune has been steady as a rock on this one and I am proud of him.
I remember him saying on a Hugh Hewitt interview that of the hand written snail mail he had gotten, there was only one piece in support of this mess. There was 702 pieces at that point too. He said the e-mails and phone calls were running in the same proportion.
It is so nice to see that he was not about to tell us he knew better and go against the voters wishes. He never wavered.
Wubbies World, MSgt, USAF (Retired):
public static void main(String[] args) {
System.out.println("An argument is a sequence of statements aimed at demonstrating the truth of an assertion.); }
I live in Mississippi, and I called Senator Cochran's DC and Jackson and Oxford, Mississippi officies. On every call I implored the senator to stand with the people of our state and vote NO on cloture for this horrid bill.
When the moment of truth came, Senator Cochran stood with his constituents. Thank you, Senator Cochran. You have voted for the rule of law over the clamor of the illegal labor lobby. You have stood for ensuring the national sovereignty for the United States over the screams of leftist organizations like La Razza. You have stood for enforcement first and foremost. For this stand your fellow Mississippians give you their deepest gratitude.
Also I want to extend my appreciation to those in the U.S. Senate and House who have fought this fight from day one. Thank You, Senator Sessions and Representative Tom Tancredo.
Both of you shine as examples of what our elected leaders should be like, in that you listen to the will of the people and fight for what is right and just.
God bless you all who voted NO to end debate on this monstrosity of a bill. Hopefully we can quit wasting valuable time and effort on another one of these stupid bills and start working vigorously to complete the 800+ miles of security fence authorized in 2006.
Enforce the border, deport criminal aliens and truly punish those who hire illegals. Then and only then can we can have an open and honesty debate about what to do with those illegals currently living among us.
Again, my thanks to my senator and all who stood for the rule of law.
Also to Senators Graham and McCain, your political moment of truth is coming in 2008. Hope your bags are packed.
You have been an embarrasment to our fine state during this entire episode. Your self-serving attitude and arrogant statements have show a whole lot of Mississippians that you think pretty highly of yourself and not highly of us in the least bit. I sincerely hope you take your 35 years of service and stick it in your coat pocket. Do us a favor and retire while you still have a few voters left who respect you.
Here are the votes that changed from the failed cloture vote three weeks ago to today's.
Yea to Nay (5) - came to their sense?
Brown, Harkin, Nelson (NE), Stabenow, Voinovich
Nay to Yea (6) - leadership/caved to leadership pressure?
Boxer, Craig, Gregg, Kyl, Lott, Snowe
NV to Nay (3) - Brownback AKA Switchback
Brownback, Coburn, Enzi
non-existent to Nay (1)
Barrasso
Biggest disappointments to me are Craig and Gregg; Snowe is less surprising. Kyl and Lott did it for tactical reasons as part of leading the charge. Four Dems switching in the right direction is a nice surprise. Brownback SAID he would have voted Nay originally. Allegedly he voted Yea today until he saw it was doomed, then switched to Nay. This man wants to be President?
This is the first cloture vote from June 7th, and Brownback's vote is clearly recorded. After Reid failed, he scheduled another cloture vote outside the regular order of business (not just for the day, but for the week), and Brownback had an engagement that he had to attend. Since he had already voted against cloture once, and wasn't changing his mind, and since NV is as good as "nay" on cloture votes, he was NV for the second vote.
I'll have something up later tonight on his vote today.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
I'd also like to know if he has any ideas related to where we go now.
Thanks.
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CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.
Is that he believes in comprehensive immigration reform, but understands that the country is not ready for it. As such, he believes that the issue must be put to rest until people feel that the border is secured.
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[F]or by the fundamental law of Nature, man being to be preserved as much as possible, when all cannot be preserved, the safety of the innocent is to be preferred...
-John Locke
Like you said, the second vote that day was weird and a NV counted as a nay. His actions today make no sense to me, and seeing you explanation in another thread made it sound even loopier to me.
I have written each of the Senators that voted against this travesty and thanked them for their willingness to listen to the American people. I also asked that they not ignore the issue simply because this bill has been put on the back burner, but to fight to secure our borders and strictly enforce our current immigration laws. Needless to say, an energized America will be watching.
He looks like an Orc from the Lord of the Rings movies.
Why does the WH say the fight is over? Why not come back with an enforcement-only bill?
Sorry SanDiego 92108, but we have laws on the books right now that Bush refuses to enforce.
Remember that he has fought against increasing the staffing of the Border Patrol (even Nancy Pelosi supported this)?
The chances of an employer of illegal aliens facing a significant penalty as less than they were under Clinton!
Libby Dole's office and told her staffers to thank the Senator.
It was comforting to know that I knew Libby would do the right thing, without being prodded and threatened.
Senator Burr is another story. I sent him another e-mail, telling him I WOULD thank him for changing his mind, but I believe he did it out of job security, and NOT because it was the right thing to do. If he's challenged in a primary, he's toast.
My county (Lincoln) has more hispanics than any other of the 100 counties in NC. Some are legal, some are not.
Now it's time to do 2 things.
1.Make the border to mexico tighter than a hangmans noose around the neck of a murderer.
2.Cut 1.2 billion dollars in overall foreign aid spending, and offer American citizens a 100.00 TAX EXEMPT bounty for every Illegal alien they turn in to the INS. We have LOTS of military bases that have been closed. They can be corraled in there, and put on CON AIR planes that land in Mexico City.
Let them find their OWN way back to whatever rat-hole they came out of. That would be the best spent 1.2 Billion by our government in the last 45 years.
Hank In NC
Congratulations on defeating the Amnesty Bill. We now see how they operate. The back room deals to sell the American people out. They quell free speach and the right of the people to dissent. It makes me sick. We the people need to take this country back from the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and all the other special interest groups who write these bills. "Winds of change is a blowing."
PLEASE for heaven's sake sharpen up a silver stake and run it through the heart of this piece of crap?
"Cowards cut and run, Marines never do"