Senate Dems Disavow MoveOn
wednesdays, 8pm, third stall
By streiff Posted in Democrats — Comments (81) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
So, how does it feel, boyo? Working at Starbucks, putting off getting that killer tat so you can send some cash to end the War in Iraq and maybe impeach Chimpy McBushitler. You give up valuable time you could have spent grooming your soul patch or creating mystical Celtic weavings in your underarm hair passing out literature on behalf of Democrat candidates. You feel important. The candidates go to your freakfests and pay attention to your theories and ideas.
Then, finally, your team is in power and you gotta know this war is going to end yesterday with a Truth Commission just waiting in the wings. Who knows. Maybe Al Gore will be given the presidency for two terms as compensation for Bush v. Gore.
But it doesn't play out that way. Just yesterday Harry Reid admits that he doesn't have the votes to do anything about Iraq until next summer. Maybe. At the earliest. If he can get around to it.
And what gives with this 60 vote stuff?
Then today the Senate votes 72-25 to condemn MoveOn for the ad they bought in the New York Times labeling General Petraeus as General Betray Us. 72-25. They can't muster 60 votes to end the war but they can find 72 votes to condemn MoveOn for exposing Bush's sockpuppet.
Feeling good about yourself, boyo? How's that self-respect doing? Oh, did I mention, they want you to send more money to help end the war.
Even dim bulbs buy a clue eventually.
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Senate Dems Disavow MoveOn 81 Comments (0 topical, 81 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »
with our party over amnesty and when we roared our R's payed attention...I am amused at the children learning the lesson of politics however sedition? move on only has as they say 3.5 million members, they can only be as seditious as their politico's allow them to be.
I think in the end politicians will do whatever and say whatever to their base to get elected again. It is all about preservation. The largest part of America still loves America and people like Hillary just have not quite caught on to the fact that we don't take our news spoon fed anymore and the ads of her voting no against a real American hero will show her betrayal of this country.
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
what they are up to. You will eventually learn that, if you last long enough.
Gordon Taylor
Managing Editor
I'd rather not see it appear again on this site ever. By rather I mean "it won't."
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
After all, did we not graciously permit all those Democratic legislators to attend Yearly Kos? Well, at least until we needed them back on the job, and passing the FISA bill.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
I suppose that I just disapprove of reinforcing these people's delusion that they're anything more than one vote and an averaged amount of money.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
This all seems terribly trivial. Is this really what the most powerful legislative body in the world should be focusing on? Really?
I'm sure far more people who saw the ad through all the subsequent media coverage than did in the Times.
You guys are pretty trigger happy. I've read this site for a while and am trying to engage in civil discourse. Do my opinions get me banned?
that stupid opinions don't merit a polite reception. Feeling lucky?
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
with a newspaper ad? That's stupid?
I wish you guys would be more civil towards readers and commenters who hold a different opinion.
it isn't about a newspaper ad, it is about a group trying to influence the direction of the war. The war is important.
You seem to be under the misapprehension that we missed you before your started posting or that we will miss you if you are vaporized. Let me assure you, we did pretty well before you registered and to date you've done little but whine like a little girl over anticipated actions.
This is our house. You accomodate us. Not the other way around. You don't like the rules. Door. Way out. Etc.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
...I wish that you had tried to get your account reinstated honestly, rather than sneak back on under a different username. Seriously.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
I wonder if he'll try to sneak back on by Climbing In Through The Bathroom Window? We just need to Come Together and tell him to Carry That Weight somewhere else.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
Consensus doesn't prove anything, in science or anywhere else, except in democracy, maybe. - Reid Bryson, speaking on Global Warming
...when they see me they'll say, "There goes Loren Wallace,
the greatest thing to ever climb into a race car."
wasting a month last sping debating and trying to pass non-binding resolutions? I think you have your head shoved in a mustard bottle.
like what?
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
a defense bill to finish, AG to confirm, transportation bill to finish, etc.
http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/legislative/b_three_sections_with_tease...
isn't ready for passage. An acting AG is as good as a confirmed one, a transportation bill?? fergawdsake.
Here we have a rather shadowy group with dubious financing trying to destroy the public's current positive view of the commander in Iraq in order to defeat US policy aims in Iraq and you can seriously say a transportation bill matters at all? Or an AG who will serve less than 18 months?
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
Move On gets more money to be a bigger embarrassment to the Democrats. That makes it harder for the Democrats to suck up to their hate discretely; they have to pay a price for it.
In the short term that wins some elections for Republicans, having the long term effect of forcing the Democrats to dissociate themselves from those extremists. America will be better off if its left of center party isn't groveling to lunatics.
who damage the rest of the country. Moveon is doing a great job of damaging the Dems. The worse Moveon gets the better we should like it. I want the defiant face of 3 million America-haters out there for EVERYONE to see. They may be extremely loud but they are a minority (much to the Drive-Bys' dismay).
I actually went to that DKos post and read it (something I almost never do). What he wants to do looks like great times for our side. Other than seeing Hillary! ensnared in a huge Justice/SEC investigation and O.J. possibly rotting away in prison the rest of his life (if only), this could be our best entertainment. And 2 of those have significance way beyond tabloid fodder.
You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you.
I think MO.o is a blessing for the GOP ....Now, if we could only get the likes of Howard Dean and Cynthia Mckinney back in the spot light....
" in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years."
Abe Lincoln
...with something that'll work, Harry Reid will sign off on it, and Nancy Pelosi will reconcile the House version after a token revolt.
As usual.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
They also have massive amounts of pork to distribute. You cannot forget that all important job of Congress.
...a long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right...
---Thomas Paine---
With so many vital issues at hand, why are they even still talking about this?
This is a sad example of a relitively small squabble that is taking up reporting space from issues that DO matter.
Say Immigration reform. Is anybody willing to say that arguing over a newspaper ad is more pressing than securing our borders?
it isn't about a newspaper ad. It is about a direct assault on the integrity of the officer the President and Senate have chosen to prosecute our national policy in Iraq. It is about attacking his integrity so that his testimony and statement on the war in Iraq will be viewed as untrustworty.
Sorry, those 12 million illegals have been here for a while and will be here a while longer. This is more important.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
This is more of a "gotcha" political issue. The vote has absolutly no standing on ANYTHING except the next election cycle.
Inappropriate? Hell yes. Something thats going to potentially make America a better place? Not so much.
It isn't creating jobs, or fighting terrorists, or educating youth. It's just giving fodder for contenders for the contested Senate seats in '08.
I would understand if you were to tell me that in the grand scope of things, this is a major issue as to where America will be in the future. This could cause Senators to lose their jobs, and change the political landscape of the country 20 years down the line. It COULD have a big impact. HOWEVER, that is not the same as saying there are way more important things that they should be doing.
that we're never going to agree on this because the Congress doesn't create jobe, it doesn't educate kids, and the guy being defended by the Senate is the guy in charge of killing terrorists.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
Nobody is forcing anybody to agree. Everybody has their own priorities, and order of business in Congress.
I simply would like to see a little more working for us, and less working for their own political future. =)
... is more productive than a typical day's work on capitol hill.
Lectures on good manners and basic human decency don't do anything to modify MoveOn's McCarthyite tactics. Only when it becomes politically disadvantageous for their enablers in the Democratic leadership, will MoveOn be given any incentive to abandon hate as their unifying social force.
Today was a small step in the right direction toward reasoned democratic debate.
It's not just an ad, and anyone who says it is is feeling mighty defensive and just wants to change the subject quickly. What Moveon did and when they did it had the goal of offending and outraging a huge swath of the American public, and achieved that goal. They did NOT help the Dems. They DID hand their side a big problem (which might have also been a goal; I can't tell if Moveon is that Machiavellian).
This country as a whole will never get on board with the heinous fear and loathing of America that that ad embodies. It's not just an ad. It is an ideology, a way of life, a longterm strategy. If the lines weren't drawn before, they certainly are now.
And please get over your delusion that the Senate works for us. They are supposed to but in reality they work for themselves and mainly in staying in the Senate. The less they actually do, the better off we all are.
You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you.
the Democrats taken office not been a "gotcha" moment, how many votes on Iraq have they had and lost?
This "gotcha" moment was for a real American hero sir who deserved the dignity and respect of those who voted him to go over to Iraq for war and immediately starting questioning his ability before the surge had begun.
I personally find nothing not even illegal immigration and believe me that is a huge issue for me more necessary at this time in our history as we fight a preverse ideology that would seek to destroy our way of life, transportation bill....give me a break.
Freedom of Religion not Freedom from Religion
The dems have done nothing since their election to merit holding the majority in '08. Unfortunately the GOP hasn't exactly stepped up to provied a viable alternative.
Democrats have been more concerned about making up for the last 7 years and all the crow that they've eaten then making the "progress" that they ran on.
The only good thing going on right now is a little oversight, which, unfortunately, isn't really amounting to anything.
vote taken by the Senate this year.
From Streiff's posts, he seems mostly concerned about the general. I like the general, but quite honestly I think he's probably even more adept at dealing with MO than Sean Connery's thumb was at dealing with other cowards in The Presidio, so I'm not too concerned about him. Same thing goes for the troops in the field.
The ad is deeply revealing, not about the general, but about MO. They are using techniques developed by Hitler and Himmler, and "refined" by Stalin and Mao: Lie loudly and repeatedly, inflame hatred, tear apart the country to obtain the power you desire. If we allow them to continue unopposed, they will succeed in seriously damaging the country. Americans have seen that in the ad. And that made some Dems neverous. Not enough of them, but some.
I'm actually a bit hopeful as a result of this ad. It crossed a line that was crossed before in Vietnam. But this time unlike last, the American people have responded by recognizing that the people who posted it, and the newspaper that discounted it, are at least unpatriotic if not outright traitors/seditionists. We haven't yet taken this to its logical conclusion, but at least we are fighting back. And yesterday's vote in the Senate was about that fight. They put MO on notice that they only own 25 Senators, which even though many of those 25 are in leadership positions, isn't enough to control the agenda. So Harry Reid, who can at least read the writing on the wall even though he keeps trying deny its reality, backed off a bit from undermining the GWoT.
Yes, I want the border closed. Yes, I want the Bush tax cuts extended. Yes, I want the war fully funded until the battle in Iraq, which is part of the GWoT is won. Yes, I don't want the kook from Iran in NYC. But frankly, this ad IS more important than all of those, because in dealing with this ad, we are dealing with the 5th (and maybe 6th) columns that are already in our country, and in the end, even if I got my way on all the other stuff I just listed, if we don't stop them, we lose.
Reid, et al that called the General a liar.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
www.race42008.com
www.hinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"One man with courage makes a majority" - Andrew Jackson
of the "profane bullsh[*]t" locution in the kosmonaut's last graph. heehee.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
And I feel fine. Go figure. What am I supposed to be redeemed to ? And who made a Kossack my putative redeemer ?
______________________________
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
-Thomas Paine: The American Crisis, No. 4, 1777
I enjoyed the OP's imagery like "Working at Starbucks, putting off getting that killer tat so you can send some cash to end the War in Iraq" even though I knew of course it was exaggerated for effect. But then I look at some of the comments in the linked Kos diary, and wonder is it really an exaggeration? e.g.:
I've walked miles, knocking on doors, sweating bullets, trying to get Democrats elected.
I've sent money when my rent was due.
I've STILL got the Kerry/Edwards bumper sticker on my car
I've diaried like mad. I've contributed to causes and groups.
And then the ultimate:
I've argued with people in barbershop waiting areas.
It truly warms my heart... :-)
This something it is not. This is pure politicking but beyond that it is effective politicking. Let us all stop pretending that some Noble goal was sought after. It was not. The only thing that was accomplished here was putting Dems on the record either with Move on or with the general and frankly so what.
They didn't spend weeks but hours on this. It is on the record and they frankly are not so busy on important work that the did not have time for this.
"The nine most dangerous words in the English language are 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help'"
Ronald Reagan
work to do.
____
CongressCritter™: Never have so few felt like they were owed so much by so many for so little.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
www.race42008.com
www.hinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"One man with courage makes a majority" - Andrew Jackson
would be best, since they refuse to recess themselves permanently. I'm probably paraphrasing Americans from 100 years ago but have we ever had a worse Congress since our founding?? I just don't believe it.
100% Congressional turnover now.
You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you.
I would like to keep DeMint. n/t.
...a long habit of not thinking a thing wrong, gives it a superficial appearance of being right...
---Thomas Paine---
...that THIS American won't do! I've tried it a couple of times but I get nauseated easily.
www.scottbomb.com
Click here to donate to the Fred Thompson campaign.
The guys you have worked so hard to get elected...
Dramatically increased the size and reach of the federal government with NCLB, DHS, drug supplemental...
Increased farms subsidies and corporate welfare...
Dramatically increased the number of earmarks...
Had no impact on the number of abortions performed...
Have gotten caught in several corruption and sex scandals...
Got us involved in a long, expensive war that 60% of the country now thinks was a mistake...
So... pretty much nothing that conservatives are supposed to believe in. Maybe you can save the gloating over how horribly our people represent our views when you guys manage to get some people elected that represent your views.
One thing I will say is frustrating is this "60 vote" thing. I can't believe Democrats are rolling over so easily on this. Filibuster is an important minority right in the Senate, but these "gentlemen" filibusters are crap. If Republicans want to filibuster, they should have to do so publicly and risk the potential fallout from being "obstructionist". Democrats should be calling it from the rooftops, not rolling over and quietly changing the rules to allow Republicans to force super-majority votes on anything they feel like.
supported MoveOn.org.
Mike Gamecock DeVine @ The Charlotte Observer
www.race42008.com
www.hinzsightreport.com
www.theminorityreportblog.com
"One man with courage makes a majority" - Andrew Jackson
One thing I will say is frustrating is this "60 vote" thing. I can't believe Democrats are rolling over so easily on this. Filibuster is an important minority right in the Senate, but these "gentlemen" filibusters are crap. If Republicans want to filibuster, they should have to do so publicly and risk the potential fallout from being "obstructionist". Democrats should be calling it from the rooftops, not rolling over and quietly changing the rules to allow Republicans to force super-majority votes on anything they feel like.
Kharma. Quite the revolving b*tch on wheels, huh?
Moe
PS: Impressive laundry list. Guess that means that your Party's in favor of increasing the size and reach of the federal government, increased farms subsidies and corporate welfare, increased earmarks, not lowering the amount of abortions performed, and doesn't have the guts to end this war. Seeing as how they're the majority Party, now. But hey. I'm reasonable. When it comes to sex scandals and corruption, at least, Republican legislators have shown that they can sink just as far, and just as fast, as their Democratic counterparts. Impressive, seeing as your Party has half a century's worth of experience on us in that regard. :)
We'll now pause for the traditional denial of personal responsibility by the individual for the misdeeds of the group to which he belongs / is affiliated with / marches alongside of / [insert new excuse here].
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
At least our party takes them to the woodshed. The Dems re-elect theirs.
www.scottbomb.com
Click here to donate to the Fred Thompson campaign.
I for one am wholly non-responsible for the idiots in Congress now.
OK, I voted for Feinstein and Boxer in the 90s but I've left CA and regained my mind since then.
Maurice Hinchey is my Congresscritter. Need I say more?! Oh the humanity!!
You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you.
...does make things easier for me, in that regard. My Senators and Representative are my responsibility - I voted, after all - but it's not my fault that they're in office.
The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC. I've been usurped!
Except for the year or two when I lived up by Fredneck and was able to proudly claim the Honorable Bartlett as my representative.
this is festivus for us. Right now we're discussing your shortcomings not ours.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
Just pointing out that partisans on both sides regularly take it on the chin, despite putting a lot of effort into getting people elected.
"Have gotten caught in several corruption and sex scandals..."
Cunningham and Craig are gone or going, Jefferson and Frank are still proud Dems.
Well, if your guys had agreed with our guys about getting rid of it a couple years back it wouldn't still be a problem.
We never tried to get rid of the filibuster for items on the legislative calendar, for good reason.
Only the executive calendar items were supposed to become filibuster-proof.
HTML Help Central for Red Staters
Reality: Thompson/Romney Dream: Santorum/Watts.
.....and, frankly, I am grateful that they took a few minutes to do so.
I would say it is an added bonus that we also now have a list of Enemy Sympathizers.
I don't see politics in this--I see doing the right thing.
Hebrews 11:8
Jeremiah 33:3
Like "The Great Eight Lawyers" scandal that is approaching Methuselah proportions.
Did some poor soul list "creating jobs" as an important thing? If a person seriously believes government creates jobs then I believe in government subsidies for lobotomies.
The important thing is that this at least does no harm [think of Hillary taking her health care vampire out of it's grave and siccing it on us] and may even awaken some of the less deranged on the left to the idea that loyalty is a sometimes thing and the power they crave is not so easily bought.
"a man's admiration for absolute government is proportinate to the contempt he feels for those around him". Tocqueville
is whether they will sign a pledge to refuse to take any donations directly or indirectly from the group they just voted against.
they like the money a lot.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
when the villans turn on each other and the theatre goers say "that would never happen in real life."
I'm feeling better about the Senate 2008 elections.
Claire McCaskill, who is shaping up rather like the Democrat version of Peter Fitzgerald (former Sen from IL), voted along with the other Dems to support the Cornyn amendment. Well, apparently that didn't set well with Mo.o and the other radicals. Today's St. Louis Post-Dispatch covers McCaskill's vote on the amendment and the resulting hissy fit from the aforementioned scumbums.
I sent McCaskill a thank-you email this morning. If any of the rest of you have Dem senators who voted to support that amendment, please call or write them TODAY to thank them for their vote. We need to counteract the KosKidz on this one.
...when they see me they'll say, "There goes Loren Wallace,
the greatest thing to ever climb into a race car."
Funny, the same thing came to my mind when someone (here, I think) posted a link to some lefty fest in SFO. The CP booth definitely had that feel to it...
...when they see me they'll say, "There goes Loren Wallace,
the greatest thing to ever climb into a race car."
of folks who really don't agree about much -- except hating Bush. The strain of holding that together is beginning to show.
--
We would also like to know your advice for somebody like my daughter, who's going to graduate in two years, advice that you would give a young person.
SEC. RUMSFELD: Advice for a young person. Study history.
I used the link to the Kos site. Thanks! Now I have to go home and shower!
Well, I certainly won't be able to thank my Sens for their support of Gen Petraeus - one no vote and one absent. Its unfortunate, but expected.
Is this the start of a schism? Well, maybe a little splintering...good for Reps.... I see many are VERY upset over there. Don't they know that the fact that they tear their hair out is ridiculous and their blogs have little impact to the vast majority of people who pay no attention to any MSM.
Erik
Why not consider publishing your own newsletter, or magazine. You couldn''t miss if some of the regular contributors here at RS would add their flavor to it.
Just a thought.
GB
De Opresso Liber
have you visited me here?
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling
You need to learn what Moveon.Org is really up to. Two places:
1: http://www.enticy.org click on MoveOn.Org Act Three Is Hidden or access the piece directly at
http://www.enticy.org/institute/index.cgi?e=main_nav&n=128