The Bill Comes Due

and the people paying it are in uniform

By streiff Posted in Comments (61) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »

April 15 is historically associated with the filing of your IRS Form 1040.

This year it is associated with something else.

On April 15, the Army will start curtailing the training of troops being deployed into combat , equipment to be used in training for deployment will cease, the home station training of National Guard troops will be suspended.

Thank you, Democrats. Great work. You are wonderful Americans.


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The Bill Comes Due 61 Comments (0 topical, 61 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »

The Republicans just won't let them spend it so it will look like a big deal. Or something.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070331/ap_on_go_co/iraq_funding_deadline

"The real deadline for Congress to provide more money for the war in
Iraq is well beyond the April 15 deadline cited by
President Bush and Defense Secretary Robert Gates.

The Pentagon can take several penny-pinching steps without harming troop readiness or other dire consequences predicted by the Bush administration until Congress actually comes up with the money.

Mid-April is about when $70 billion provided by Congress for the war will run out. After that, Pentagon accountants will move money around in the department's more than half-trillion dollar budget to make sure operations in Iraq and
Afghanistan are not disrupted
."

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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

You are misrepresenting the facts here.

First, you can't reprogram money to support the war in Iraq and Afghanistan and not disrupt operations. The money has to come from somewhere.

Now you may be of the postion that repairing real property, like hospitals, for instance, isn't important. Or that training isn't important. Or that it is fine to shut down training depots and stop buying equipment.

Most don't.

As each of the milestones are reached real damage is done. If a maintenance depot furloughs its workers because the money is being reprogrammed, the damage can't be made up by an appropriation later. You can't buy time.
"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling

disingenuous that the Congress would pass a bill that members of the majority readily admit that, once Bush vetoes it, they will pass a "crap free" version to fund the operations in the war zones. They pass the veto bait and then go on vacation so they can't meet in conference to send it to the President for his veto so they can get on the business of funding guy who are being shot at.

The Democrats in this Congress are the worst excuse for Americans and for human beings that this country has ever seen. I am freely questioning their patriotism (actually, I'm not questioning it, they aren't) and that of anybody who supports this rank behavior. They really should move somewhere else. Like Darfur.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

and I'm not by any means defending the Democrats' approach to the bill. But the Pentagon does have the money needed past April 15th, even if it takes some redistribution. So to say five days from now that the money will run out for the troops is ridiculous.

or the farm bill, I wouldn't quibble. We're talking about funding the military in time of war. The argument about WHEN the money will - or may - run out is moot. That we are having the discussion AT ALL is the point.

The current crop of elected Democrats are simply disgraceful and disgusting. My opinion is actually MUCH stronger, but Moe would ban me, my IP and have streiff show up at my house if I put it here.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

in the notion that Congress will drag this out til the summer and neglect the supplemental. Just today Bush invited Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi down to the WH to talk about the bill. Reid dismissed it because of "preconditions" set up by the President, notably withholding the withdrawal timetable. So there are already signs that this will be negotiated, we just don't know how long it will take. But I wouldn't subscribe to the idea that Democrats are going to cut off funding. It's a give and take.

I highly doubt the Democrats will fail to provide the supplemental; they're just trying to get all they can out of it. Take that for what you will.

I have close friends who are dependent on that "give and take" for their lives. Sorry, but your argument and all of your talking points are simply crap.

I can assemble about 150 Marine Corps families if you'd like to make a formal presentation about how this doesn't matter. HINT: wear body armor.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

(I now regret I used this phrase) is what occurs in a democracy when two separate parties are in control of two coequal branches of government. This is not an "argument", it is the fact of the matter. If I am arguing anything, it's that the fued over the supplemental bill is a natural democratic process. I have not said once that the bill "doesn't matter", and it's dishonest to imply such.

And I certainly recognize the importance to this funding to all of those men and women whose lives depend on it. This fact does nothing if support my "argument." The reason this fued will resolve itself is hinged on the fact that troops are on the ground, in danger, everyday. That's why Congress and the White House will undoubtedly come to a compromise before the lack of funds starts impacting soldiers on the ground.

I'm surprised you don't just tell the soldiers to eat some cake while they're waiting for the nation's Mother-in-law to return from the outhouse.

A pox on you and yours.

Compromise is what the legislative process uses to create legislation. The Democrats voted to go to war. They are obliged to fund that effort, WITHOUT COMPROMISE and UNCONDITIONALLY, until it is over. To attempt to do otherwise just reveals them to be the lying, stinking, scumbags that they are.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

By whom? The Congress controls the cash.

It's called Integrity!

The Democrats are under no legal authority to fund this war.

Integrity means that a body that votes to place troops in harm's way has an obligation to fund them. But then, both the concept of integrity and obligation are foreign to libs.

I'd just like to know, why do you blame the Democrats for not funding the troops? Congress passed the bill, Bush will veto, effectively delaying the money. Now, Congress knew it would be vetoed, and you could indirectly say the delay is their fault, but when it comes down to it, Bush is the one that will be vetoing the money. Why not chastise the President for failing to sign the bill? I have no intention of offending anyone, I'd simply like to know.

you can keep your childish debate tactic. Even YOU are not that stupid. "Slow bleed" ring a bell?

But it just doesn't make much sense to me that if you want to troops to have the funds as soon as possible, why not demand the President sign the bill?

Just because I'm from the other side of the aisle does not mean we should not be able to have a rational discussion. I come in peace.

someone for not dropping dead.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

that liberals use as a moral code.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

Comparing the Constitution to a floater.

for lying about what I posted unless you can highlight in my post where I wrote "Constitution".

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

to my post that the Congress is not bound by the Constitution to fund this war. What other "legalism" were you referring to?

If I wanted someone to ghost write for me, I would pick someone who at least skips across the surface of intelligent thought. With a hat tip to Katie's Producer, I copied this from Dictionary.com.
"legalism: 1. strict adherence, or the principle of strict adherence, to law or prescription, esp. to the letter rather than the spirit."

You see, liberals, possessing no core moral values to benchmark a circumstance as to whether it is right or wrong, must rely on, or in most cases seek refuge in, the letter of the law.

So, the Democrat controlled Congress exercises the "legal" right to withhold funds regardless of the moral obligation to provide them.

Here endeth your lesson for the day.

NOW Bucky, I am waiting for your apology for lying about what my post said or in the alternative, you can agree to being a liar or a fool. Take you pick.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

the amount of hostility you exert on someone you don't even vaguely know. Sure, you didn't specifically reference the Constitution, but the sentiment is the same. Democrats somehow hide behind the letter of the law to further their amoral and unAmerican agenda, when the Constitution is the basis of all things American.

You have a preconceived notion of who I am because I lean a certain way politically. Apparently, I have no core values and no judgment of right and wrong. And God forbid I bring up the Constitutional relevance of the supplemental debate. The fact that you can have such contempt for your fellow countrymen based on their political leanings is disturbing and something I do not envy. The tone of your post suggests you consider yourself far better than I could ever be, and I don't appreciate it one bit. My name is not Bucky and I do not need any lessons from you.

Get off your high horse.

in that you were offended by the diminutive, the sentiment was not the same and in stating that you continue to dishonestly misrepresent my post. Honesty is must be a stranger to you. Second, the Constitution is not the basis of all things American, only an ignoramus would claim that it is. Third, I am better than you and any liberal because liberals are untrustworthy due to their attenuation to moral equivalency as a substitute for a conscience. Fourth, I hardly consider most on the Left my countrymen this not being France or the United Nations. Fifth, you may be right about the lessons, I also failed to teach my dog to drive though he at least displayed some aptitude for learning.

Oh, and bringing up the Constitutional relevance of the Supplemental Funding debate is a retreat to legalism in the face of the moral obligation to fund the war for which a majority of the Democrats voted.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

in the soul of anyone that votes to send someone else into harms way to protect the sender. Passing a pile of crap like this is a ploy to force Bush into a veto to protect HIS Constitutional authority and all that follow him. It is a poorly disguised stall tactic that's nothing more than a shell game. If defunding is what you want then don't pass a bill at all and have the guts to put that out in front of the voters.
You brag about constitutional authority but have no problem trying to trample on the executive. Were you a patriot this would matter to you. Yep, damn rights I'm calling you and anyone supporting this treasonous act traitors for trying to take over as commander in chief. Not to mention Pelosi and her BS. The tipping point is screwing with our troops that need the money for their families while you have the gall to think it is ok to take your time debating it. Behind bars and in chains is too good for those making this frontal assault on our troops and the constitution.
Bush won in 04 get over it!

they have to pay for it. Kinda like ordering a meal in a restaurant and eating all of it. You are obliged to pay for it. Now, take a bite or two and declare it not satisfactory and get up and leave, different story. What you don't get to do is sit there and eat while complaining loudly about the cook and saying you are only going to pay for the parts you like whenever you get around to it.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

This weekend the Democrats said that they will not let the troops go unfunded, even if that means removing stuff from the supplemental after the president vetoes.

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

You're just trying to see how far I bend the posting guidelines aren't you, MoeLane41. Sneaky. Streiff will show up with beer and homeland security will show up with a SWAT Team.

Not taking bait. Nice try though. :>)
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

Well of course those comparisons wouldn't be fair, because those are "investments" whereas most money spent on DoD in general* and the GWOT in particular are wasteful.

*Exception: Pork or base expansion projects are considered important national security investments by the Representatives and Senators in whose states/districts those projects are funded.

read the story. Read the link.

"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling

I remember when there was a budget short fall and the military had to redistribute money to meet mission essential spending.

I went without a paycheck for a few days.

I am not kidding, it really happened when we ran out of money at the end of the fiscal year. Now they are insisting we do it again?!!!

-Major Snark Warning-
After all, who cares if the wives at home don't get a check to go grocery shopping. It's no big deal right? The kids can miss a few few meals, they are over weight anyway.

It makes my blood boil to see people who have never been in the military, who have never experienced one of these budget shortfalls talk like it is no big deal. Of course it's no big deal to them. They don't have to deal with it! There wives and kids haven't experienced not getting paid.

"Wubbies World" - MSgt, U.S. Air Force (Retired): "Call to Me and I will answer you, and I will tell you great and mighty things, which you do not know." -Jer 33:3-

Yep,we went from getting paid at the end of the month to the 1st. Put quit a few families in distress.

Don

the year you didn't get paid on Dec 31st. Helped Bill Clinton balance a budget didn't it?

Yeah someone's sure to bring up a technicality that we really spent the same amount of money, but no one should challenge the great job Clinton did in creating the best economy in the last 428,271 years.

Lets stop funding the School Lunch Program and let the USDA "move money around" so kids don't go hungry! No problem.

if you must juggle limited funds, you start robbing Peter to pay Paul, and hope that Peter doesn't get so ticked off that he finds another market for his services.

Now the military Peter doesn't have that option. But if his supplies and equipment and training get interrupted, he could get killed. Contractor Peter can pull the plug at any time.

I have worked through a corporate bankruptcy situation. Let me assure you that months before one runs out of money, one switches to the very, very, very short-term time horizon and does nothing else. This was extremely disrupting. And no one was shooting at us.

Do the Democrats really want the armed forces to go through this? What about all that "tough and smart" defense thinking we were supposed to get? I guess that's so YESTERDAY. This approach to defense funding is mind-boggling.

n.b.- The actual tax-filing date this year is April 17. The 15th falls on a Sunday. The 16th is a holiday in Washington DC, so the IRS gave us an extra day while they're off at the beach or wherever they go on their holidays. Bless them!

a defense supplemental bill.

Your article is from 2005. On our planet this is the year 2007

"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling

and that ignores the fact that a continuing resolution to fund the military at the previous years level was passed to fully fund operations. The new budget allowed new components to enter the budget, like pay raises.

"Wubbies World" - MSgt, U.S. Air Force (Retired): "Call to Me and I will answer you, and I will tell you great and mighty things, which you do not know." -Jer 33:3-

The military will not come to a halt on April 15. Funds can be shifted and there will be no disruption until June. I think President Bush has shown leadership in his invitation to talk to Dems-with the understanding that it isn't for negotiating withdraw. It's obvious that the Dems are clueless and have nothing to offer other than withdraw. It's also obvious that the Reps have no plan for victory. The funds will come because the Bush Admin and Rep will hold their ground and the Dems simply don't have enough unity.

Applying lipstick to a pig doesn't change the fact that it's still a pig.

Funds can be shifted and there will be no disruption until June.

False on its face. Read the story. Read the link. No one agrees with what you said, least of all the JCS.

"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition." -- Rudyard Kipling

Perhaps you're correct, contingent on your definition of "disruption" and to whom it may disrupt. It won't be the men on the field until around June, regardless what the link says. "No one agrees with what you said"-- is that a consensus already taken or an advanced order to the blindless sheep?

Applying lipstick to a pig doesn't change the fact that it's still a pig.

Tell me, did they laugh at you at University, the fools?

The Fuzzy Puppy of the VRWC.

On the whole, I'd say they actually have forgotten more about the needs of the forces on the ground in Iraq than you would ever know.

George W. Bush: He's A Folder ... Not A Fighter.

is it fair to say this should be addressed to RJW and not Moe?
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

George W. Bush: He's A Folder ... Not A Fighter.

THAT stupid. Whew.

:>)
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

George W. Bush: He's A Folder ... Not A Fighter.

I was looking for a helpless kitten to drown, sure that it would make me feel better. Fortunately for the kittens in the neighborhood, you showed up just in time.

I'll feel bad and apologize later. Maybe. In the meantime, just think of the cute little kitten you saved.


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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

Why can't you do both? You mean you only drown kittens on bad days?

You're supposed to be an evil Religious Right hard Right gun-toting, heterosexist, anti-environmental, cruel to cute animals wingnut ...

Are you going soft on us?!

Next thing I know, you'll be in favor of free healthcare ...

George W. Bush: He's A Folder ... Not A Fighter.

I have to conserve my energy. Those darn kittens fight too hard to just be drowning them every day. I need to rest afterwards most times.

Free healthcare? Gee, I never thought about that one. Gimme a minute or two. I have to consult my RightWingConspiracy™ Manual. I'll probably do a blog on that one.

Heh.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

Check page 534 of the RightWingConspiracy™ manual - the Drowning Cute Animals section of the chapter on Raping The Environment - I do so love that section on dumping arsenic into the water, don't you?

Anyway, you're a rich "corporate" Republican with all that Oppressor-Halliburton money, all earned off the Oiiiiilll™ and the suffering of women, minorities, gays and endangered species.

You can hire someone to drown kittens for you - that's what I do! And I have it recorded for my viewing pleasure.

PS: The truly scary thing is that some Kossack is reading this and thinking we're being serious.

George W. Bush: He's A Folder ... Not A Fighter.

I should be banned.

I'm sorry.


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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

:-)

George W. Bush: He's A Folder ... Not A Fighter.

On the whole, I'd say they actually have forgotten more about the needs of the forces on the ground in Iraq than you would ever know.

George W. Bush: He's A Folder ... Not A Fighter.

some forward base in Iraq to re-convene. Tell them when the money runs out, the troops are leaving. Hopefully, Webb will bring his gun and own ammunition.

Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.

2nd Btn, 4th Marines just left.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

 
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