More 9/11 Tapes Released
By streiff Posted in War — Comments (10) / Email this page » / Leave a comment »
"We have six men here. Do you want us to find our way down there? ... OK, we're going to try and respond down to the trade center." (Fire Lt. Raymond Murphy, deceased)
"Ma'am, if you have to break a window, if you have to. If you don't, don't break it. I'm gonna get somebody there to get you, OK? ... I'm not going to be able to call you back, we're very busy right now. Everybody's calling me." (Unidentified dispatcher)
"Sir, did you find something and put it over your head? OK, did you see any fire at this time? Sir ... OK, I want you to go on the floor . . . Cover your head with a cloth." (Unidentified dispatcher)
"I'm going to die, aren't I?" (Melissa Doi, deceased)
"Calm down because I'm trying to help you. ... We've got to try to work together. ... Please try to calm down. Soak anything with water, put it over your mouth. Don't try to inhale it." (Unidentified dispatcher)
"There's heavy smoke and flames and the building management is announcing that everything is all right, and it's not and they're confused." (Unidentified dispatcher to dispatch supervisor)
"I'm on the 35th floor. ... Numerous burn injuries are coming down. I'm trying to send them down. ... We're still heading up." (Fire Capt. Patrick Brown, deceased)
"One of the towers just collapsed. Everybody's got to be inside of it. ... There's got to be thousands of people inside it. One of the towers just came down on top of EVERYBODY." (Unidentified fire lieutenant.)
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More 9/11 Tapes Released 10 Comments (0 topical, 10 editorial, 0 hidden) Post a comment »
some people are murdered by the religion of peace. It's just a numbers thing.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
They weren't murdered by Islam any more than people were murdered by the Inquisition were murdered by Christianity.
In both cases the victims were murdered by twisted sickos who claimed to be following those religions.
Let's keep our eye on the ball. We can't win a war against the entire Muslim world. We can win a war against the twisted sickos among them. Just look at Iraq: more Muslims there are on our side than not, aren't they? How many have been fighting alongside our own soldiers?
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"In this day and age, you're not going to get a fair shake in the media" -- Lance Armstrong
starts condeming the sickos within, I will start giving it the credit you think it deserves. But, if it doesn't, as soon as a couple of our cities are lit up by Iran sourced nuclear devices, I'm sure Allah can sort out the good from the bad when we start erasing Islamic nations from the face of the earth.
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
I don't want to jump to conclusions, so what exactly do you mean by "when we start erasing Islamic nations from the face of the earth?"
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"In this day and age, you're not going to get a fair shake in the media" -- Lance Armstrong
Leaders of mainstream organisations in the UK regularly condemn terrorist attacks. For example, see this press release from the Muslim Council of Great Britain, a well regarded and influential mainstream Islamic group:
http://www.mcb.org.uk/media/presstext.php?ann_id=150
It is you who appears the extremist here, Tbone, you are all but demanding Muslim blood. I don't think "religious warfare" rhetoric really aids anyone in this matter, nor does revisiting the spirit of the Crusades.
They killed each other one at a time. Equating those times to these is what is simplistic. When muslims quit supporting suicide bombers,(go google UK muslim surveys in that you like UK examples so much)and dancing in the streets celebrating each terrorist attack, I'll rejoice. However, the reality is the muslim mother regarding to pictures of her suicide bomber/martyred kids and remarks,"Kids today, they blowup so fast".
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
I'm willing to quibble on that point, Neil. I also don't have a problem extending that to the idea that people during the Inquisition were murdered by Christianity.
Let me elaborate. The people who are at the forefront of the terrorist movement - AQ, Hezbollah, Hamas, Abu Sayaf, etc - all draw their "authority" from highly organized and widely recognized elements of Islam. The Wahabbist movement is supported by the government (or at least prominent members of the Royal Family) of KSA.
The prominent clerical voices who encourage and support terrorist organizations are not shunned or even heavily and publicly criticized by more "mainstream" Islamic clerics. Typically, any time you hear a critical voice the criticism is couched in a way that makes clear that while the speaker might disagree with the cleric in question the real problem is the US/Israel axis.
The Wahabbist/Islamofacist wing of Islam is able to project moral authority in their community because there is no organized voice from the "religion of peace" side of Islam that makes clear that the Sadr's of the world are kooks and have absolutely no moral authority.
By contrast, you will not find Christian denominations who urge their followers to commit violent crime in the name of the Savior. There are sects who claim to be Christian, like the White Supremest movements, who do not decry violence but don't openly tell their followers that the road to heaven is paved with the murdered bodies of black people. They are also throughly and completely denounced by Christian denominations and movements from the mainstream left to the evangelical right. They have absolutely no moral authority beyond their handful of supplicants because they are so absolutely condemned by the whole of Christianity.
So, bottom line (finally), for me, is that Islam as a religious movement is responsible for the acceptance and growth of Wahabbist/Islamofacism because they don't stand firmly against the radical terrorist movements. Until the mainstream takes an unmistakable stand against those clerics who support and encourage terrorism, Islam bears responsibility in the murders by Islamofacists.
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If "pro" is the opposite of "con", what is the opposite of "progress"?
Americans have? As soon as the first nuke goes off in New York or DC, the American public will collectively determine, in the majority, that the problem is Islam, inclusive of the good and the bad. If whoever is leading the Country at that point doesn't respond by absolutely destroying the will of Islam to engage, either directly or by tacit support of those who do, in nuclear terrorism, you will have an opening for an absolute charismatic demagogue to rise to power in this country based upon his promise to destroy Islam.
Now, if the "moderates" in Islam understand that, they need to turn on the fascists within their religion. However, I see no evidence that the moderates are moderates.
Perhaps you can tolerate a few thousand airline passengers turned to fish food or a few thousand office workers turned ash and splat. Can you tolerate lower Manhattan turned to radioactive rubble?
Envisioning when all that is Left is the Right.
I see what you're saying now. Thank you. And yes, it would be terrible if a situation like that happened.
I don't find the attacks we suffered now tolerable. That's why I want to fight the war on terrorism. Terrorists of ANY kind must not be tolerated.
All the more reason to vote Republican (except in the Connecticut Senate race) in November. We have to win this war the way we're fighting it now to prevent that greater evil of a true total war of destruction from happening.
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"In this day and age, you're not going to get a fair shake in the media" -- Lance Armstrong
of how successful the evacuation of the towers really was, comparitively, because at the time we all thought there were thousands more people in the floors beneath where the planes crashed.